Comments

Comment by 363245

*You have been removed from group*

/whisper RL "Why did you kick me?"
/RL whispers "You aren't defense capped newb"
/whisper RL "But im defense capped when my Quel'Serrar procs!"

Comment by Shoat

This has an almost 100% uptime during combat, providing a great amount of both avoidance (through def) and mitigation (through armor).

I've observed our DK MT using these (while lying on the ground dead >_>), he has both the 245 and the 232 versions of this already, and I noticed that he had both buffs up all the time, even if this sword is used as an offhand the buff rarely dropped off and kept refreshing at 1-3 seconds left (while the Mainhand Buff was refreshed at 4-8 seconds duration left most of the time).

It could be used to get defense capped, but just like using the Sigil of the Unfaltering Knight to get def capped, it has it's drawbacks. If a Boss crits you during those few seconds where it's inactive you're dead.
However, I doubt that anyone being able to tank ony would need the proc to get to the crit immunity cap.

Comment by martinu

the procced spell is this one.

edit: why downrating a valid useful comment? its easy to click on the spell, but its easier to hover on a comment when you are already reading other comments.

Comment by 109170

can this be dualwielded with the 10 man drop?

Comment by hashmel

stevebat was obviously refering to DW frost tanking as the weapons you've listed blow even moreso for DW frost

the #1 stat for DW DKs is weapon damage, the ones you listed are about 300 which is horrid, the highest top end for 1 handers is around 620, this has a respectable 510 with an amazing boost to avoidance and armor...sure beats using a 1 hander with agility and crit or something for tanking

Comment by dannyboy1100

This has got nice speed for a paladin tank RECKONING!

Comment by 423920

If you were thinking about putting Unholy Weapon on this just for the looks, either for a laugh or while you save up for a better enchant... you can save your money because the unholy weapon effect doesn't seem to show up on this sword.

Comment by Reunilana

Would it work for Dualwielding Dk tanks?
https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=49495 + https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=49303
With enchant https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/spell=54446 and frost talents like https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/spell=50138 and https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/spell=49789 .

If you compare https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=40406 (120 starmina) , https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=45700 dualweild (138 starmina) or https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=45311 (111 starmina), dualweilding those 2 you gain 139 starmina wich is just a little better but you can get defense rating and 1400 or 1550 armor (not sure if those 2 stacks)

Comment by 462103

Just tested DW'ing Burnished Quel'Serrar and lvl 60 Quel'Serrar and the procs overwrite the previous one that is applied.

Comment by 438440

I've been tanking with the Gleaming version of this for a week now, and I have to say - it's better than I expected. The sanctuary buff appears to have no internal cooldown as I have seen it proc back to back, and the proc rate is quite good. I wouldn't say that the buff is up 100% of the time like one poster above, but I would estimate an active time of 50% or higher when using a standard warrior tanking rotation.

Additionally, the slower weapon speed provides a significant increase in Devastate damage - enough, I think, to make up for the greater number of Heroic Strikes or Cleaves put out with a faster weapon.

If I get this better version, I suspect I will use it all the time instead of just occasionally. Just the 1550 extra armor alone is no small thing, even if it's only half the time.

Comment by roody

Got my Quel last Night from Ony 25man and I'm loving it. I threw a Blood Draining enchant on it and testet it out on TotGC after Ony.

Concerning the Sword-Proc:

I've checked our WoL-Page from last night's raid and took the Jarraxus fight (heroic version) as an example. I'm MT'ing on that fight so I'm constantly dealing DMG and the proc had an uptime between 45% and 55% of the Time (took us like 6 tries to down him after wiping at 20% last week - yay! :)). So I reckon an average uptime of 50% - as some posters already mentioned above - is about right.

PS: I'm playing a Warrior, just in case someone's wondering.

Comment by 360150

Everyone calls it the defense cap because it's understood by the community. And it is fine if it's called that way even if it is a bit of a misnomer (it's not).

If you're going to be that anal about something like that, you should know that strictly speaking you are incorrect. There is a defense cap because you reach an avoidance cap via dodge, block, miss, and parry. This defense hard cap is higher than the soft cap, but not by that much and it is (and always has been) within reach for geared tanks. So there you go, there is a defense cap.

It does not, as you suggest, give "solid increase" to anything. 110 defense rating, or 22 defense skill does barely anything. The value of the proc is in the armor, and the defense proc is next to useless; it gives you about 3% overall avoidance. That's less than trinket proc.

Furthermore, stacking defense is one of the worst ways to gear yourself. Yes, you want 540 defense skill. However, you don't want to exceed 540 defense by too much; other stats that take up less itemization budget are--and always have been--more effective in end-game tanking, as you pointed out. This is one of the reasons "defense cap" is a fitting term.

I'm downrating you for posting wrong information then having the gall to call us ignorant.

You are, quite frankly, wrong.

First of all, the term 'cap' has grown to mean 'get it to this point and no further.' Since you can get considerable advantages from taking your defense over 540, it is not a cap. The avoidance cap you speak of is not within reach for tanks in the game currently (that would mean never getting hit.) What is within reach is the block cap, and defense helps you get there, but defense does a lot more then just that.

How much avoidance you get per point of defense rating depends on your other gear, the diminishing returns on miss, dodge and parry have quite an effect on it. Last time I checked for me, defense gave me about 98% of the avoidance that I got from dodge rating.
Since the avoidance from defense is part parry (which is better avoidance then dodge) and part miss (which is better then dodge since it is active in more situations), I think defense rating is preferable to dodge rating from a pure avoidance standpoint.
Take into consideration that you increase your chance to block as well with defense, and defense rating starts to outshine dodge rating quite easily.

Now, for me, 22 defense would give me 0.88% dodge, parry, miss and block. I'm block capped already, so you can ignore the block, but that's still 2.4% avoidance gained pre diminishing returns. Post diminishing returns, it's probably closer to 2%.
But remember, this is on top of the 60+% of avoidance I already have. So the effective avoidance I gain is about 5% - not as good as popping trinkets, but quite nice for a high-uptime buff.

Lastly, before you start calling it a defense cap again, remember that you can tank quite well without 540 defense skill - what you need is a 5.6% critical strike reduction, and if you can get that from another source, then you are good to go.
(Resilience and talents are good examples.)

Oh, I'm downranking you because you are wrong.

Comment by 207870

A lot of unrelated information in these comments, time to bring some actual facts!

The proc does not have an internal cooldown (obvious I know, but someone needs to say it)
The ppm appears to be about 2 after hitting the boss dummy (hit and expertise capped) for about 2 hours (it might be less, the numbers were ranging from 1.8-1.99, but knowing Blizzards love for even numbers...)
It can proc from any attack using the sword, so if we assume a ppm of 2, the chance of getting the proc on any instant attack (such as Devastate, Blood Strike etc) would be 8% ((2/60)*2.4).
Haste effects increase the rate (since the chance per attack stays the same) so in a raid setting you will have higher proc rates
Just like on the old Quel'Serrar, Enchantment glows are not shown!

Doing some rough math, with 30% raidbuffed haste you'd get 2.6 ppm from auto attacks and if you do an instant attack every 2 secs (that is very generous since only attacks with the sword count, so shield slam doesn't count, Judgement, Icy touch etc) you get another 2.4 ppm. This is disregarding parried attacks (you will never have enough expertise to negate those) and missed attacks from DW for DK tanks, so in reality you will get less procs than that.

This means we're looking at a total of 5ppm in the best possible setting, the absolute minimum to theoretically have a 100% uptime is 6 ppm and even then they'd need to come reliably every 10 secs (not going to happen) so the "almost guaranteed 100% uptime" comments are false

I'm not sure how to do statistical calculations like that, but a good guess (and from personal experience) would be an uptime of around 50%, which greatly diminishes the value of the proc. Still a good tanking weapon, but there are better.

Comment by 465541

Some more anecdotal evidence about the uptime of the Sanctuary buff (links will probably be broken in a month or so, due to reports expiring):

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-3O4FsvQTVxg6Anue/details/2/?s=998&e=1298

MT on Jaxx in nToC-25, 10/5/2009: 31.4% uptime

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-jRW1tB0SJZQ9r4Dt/details/1/?s=2443&e=2729

MT on Jaxx in nToC-10, 10/3/2009: 32.6% uptime

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-jRW1tB0SJZQ9r4Dt/details/1/?s=12356&e=12538

MT on Koralon-10, 10/3/2009: 42.9% uptime

Other fights would have a lower uptime because I'm not constantly hitting something. (You'll notice the near 100% uptime on Blood Reserve as a point of reference.) I don't gear for expertise or hit specifically, but instead stack Stamina with gems and such, so I still have some misses and dodge/parries going on. Only a couple points of data in realistic settings, nothing more. :)

Comment by GaeBolge

@GaeBolge

You had quite a bit of misinformation in your post. The only thing you had right was the defense cap of 540, which some people will refer to as the cap, and others will refer to it as the floor.

For using a 1h/shield you will have 8% miss on a ? boss, not the 28% you said (Unless DW tanking as a DK, in which case, yes, you would have that much miss). The expertise softcap is 26, which is 6.5%, with the hard cap being 66 or 16.5%, at which point you will never be parried.

As for parry hasting, it's 40% increased speed for the remainder of the bosses swing timer for each parry. This isn't too big a deal for any tank except for a DW DK tank. If you have a lot of DPS in front of the boss getting parried though, that can spell bad news very quickly.

I had specifically said I had expertise cap wrong, and explained my formula for DW tanking in a post below. The guy named Durk or Dyreddyre keeps marking down all my comments to purge, so you cant see it.
And... my formula affects DW DK tanking only. If your a pally, warrior, or druid, this doesn't apply and wont work, so you shouldn't be reading it unless you plan on making a DW DK Tank.
I'll repost said comments in a moment.

Comment by Zefyrus

For all those who farmed for Foror's Compedium of Dragon Slaying back in the days in order to obtain the old Quel'Serrar but never seen it drop, this is a gift from... Blizzard. :p

Comment by m4ko

Comparison of all ilvl 245 tank weapons:
https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/compare=48699;49495;48044

Drop locations: 1x Onyxia 25 and 2x 10-man Anub hardmode

If you can't kill Anub in 25-man heroic mode for the 258 weapon your best bet to get a decent mainhand is to farm 10man heroic coliseum.

Comment by tiel

There is so much fail in that post it makes my insides hurt. Everything you said is wrong, except 540 being crit cap.

Ya having an additional 2.68% avoidance (not including block % buff) is terribly useless...the same avoidance as having 6 extra subtle cardinal rubies with about a 90% uptime...no point in that.

And maybe the main tanks for world #1 and #3 guilds, who are clearing Heroic Toc with noone dying, need to be told by you to stop putting +20 defense on their shields, since they're already at 570 defense or higher.

Comment by 241013

Testing shows that the proc can be triggered by Seal of Vengance ticks. For a prot pally who is doing their rotation, the buff has near 100% uptime. That makes this weapon better than anything dropped in TOC.

Expecting this to be downranked. Most tanks seem to misunderstand the values of armor and defense rating, as well as the proc rate. Do some reading into this weapon, don't throw it out because you can't be assed to do the math.

Comment by 301134

This will be amazing for paladin tanks. Especially with reckoning.
The ammount of mitigation 110 Def and 1.5k armor gives you is insane.
This will be my weapon of choice when beginning to tank icecrown.

Comment by 475201

RAWR says this weapon is the best overall weapon for protection paladin.

Just some additional info.

Comment by Liquids

Some statistics after my first raid night using this weapon.

I am a protection paladin without Reckoning. Obviously using Seal of Corruption for tanking.

65,9% uptime on XT (10 man hard). This is the most interesting number IMO.
76,0% uptime on Twin Valkyr (10 man hard). Mostly tanked apart but was on top of each other for maybe 1/4 of the fight.
75,9% uptime on Auriaya (10 man). Tanking her plus one add.
76,1% uptime on Kologarn (10 man). I was tanking the body.
66,4% uptime on Algalon (10 man). This is average from three wipes and a kill (62% on the kill). I was tanking him for approx. 3/4 of the time.

As you can see, I have mostly included fights where you tank a boss almost constantly to give as clear results as possible.
XT gives the purest result (you are on him constantly and you hit no other targets).
Twins and auriaya have a little splash, and kologarn has a lot of splash because of the arms.
Algalon has a little splash from stars and constellations, but in return you are not hitting him all the time (when kiting constellations and running from big bang).

Comment by 78063

No one has commented on whether a DK can Dual-Wield this and the 232 version and have the procs stack. The Procs not having an internal CD, and having every tanking ability besides Howling Blast hit with both swords would greatly increase the ppm. I don't have any math on this, but I'm pretty sure a DK can Dual-Wield the two swords and at the very least have 1 proc up constantly, and have the other one up periodically, greatly increasing mitigation and armor.

On a threat stand point, besides a Broken Promise, a Quel-Serrar is the slowest tanking weapon, making it a huge threat increase for DK's.

Can anyone confirm if these CAN be Dual-wielded and share the procs?

Comment by 43530

An Official Blizzard Wallpaper shows a Dwarf fighting Onyxia with Quel'Serrar... but here's the funny thing; he's also equipped with the Scourgestalker Helmet/Shoulders!

I'd say "Hunter Weapon!" but um... It's class-limited to Warrior/Paladin/Death Knight... so I say HAX!

Comment by 52079

Ah yes, the Quel'delar's (neglected) little tanking brother.

Lower ilvl, lower dps, with only a 6% chance of dropping in a 25-man raid (that usually employs 2 or 3 tanks, which further lowers the percentage) that can be done only once a week, whereas QD is a non-soulbound (auctionable) random drop from not one, but THREE different heroics (the number of daily runs to get it further increased by the random heroic mechanic), and can be farmed from trash with resets without getting saved to the instance, and easily assembled within the first 12 hours after the patch release.

Hmm. And people are surprised that tanking specs are under-represented in the game?

Comment by Mosruio

Somehow rawr v2.3.2 ranks this weapon over all other ilvl245 weapons for protection paladins (mitigation, avoidance and threat summed up).

Comment by Thaih

After some testing around, I am 99% sure that the two procs will NOT stack, so Dual wield DK's should not take both the 10 man and 25 man versions.

Comment by 431538

What I wonder about this sword since it is the sister blade of Quel'Delar, is why it is iL245 instead of iL251... O_o

Comment by 481166

It is probably pretty good for ICC, since Chill of the Throne makes you lose 20% dodge chance, and this would help get at least some of that dodge rating, and since it adds parry it will also compensate for some of that lost dodge.

Comment by 323598

I have not red all the comments yet but i say this:
Our main Fury war has Tank OS. he has this sword and the shield from toc (nowdays he rarely tanks so he hasnt upgraded his gear just yet). once or twice our MT died and he equiped through a macro that sword and his shield while opening shield wall. on proc he had around 546 def rating which IS the minimum def rating (Def cap).

so practically he was crit immune for the seconds of the proq (which procced around 5 seconds after the equip. that even with NO OTHER TANK GEAR (+ shield wall for the duration left) bought us an extra 25 seconds with minimal overhealing and a maintained TPS (due to the extra stats from fury). in cases like this it can be very helpfull.

The fight was festergut and the MT died at around 9% on 25-man. We still managed to finish the fight (still on the 1st boss-dmg increase)

Comment by 45790

I am so jealous of the new kids who can get Quel'serrar of a drop. I worked damn hard to get my ORIGINAL one (endless farming in Dire Maul). And there was a great story behind it. But now it is just pug and roll :'(

I hope they come up with the new forms of T1 tanking set. Cause this sword looks reaaly sexy with Mights ;)

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Burnished Quel'Serrar

	Phase 3

Item Level 245
Binds when picked up
Unique

One-Hand	Sword

275 - 511 Damage	Speed 2.00

(196.50 damage per second)
+74 Stamina
Durability 105 / 105

Requires Level 80
Chance on hit: Grants the wielder 110 defense rating and 1550 armor for 10 sec.
"The High Blade"

Sell Price: 23 80 82

Burnished Quel'Serrar

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