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Who's healing you?
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Post by
Lasthitlarry
This is more directed @ Prot pallies, the subject is pretty straightforward:
When tanking, which class is healing you, and which class do you want to be healing you?
Or, more specifically, who do you feel is the best class to be healing paladins, or tanks even.
Post by
blademeld
In a raid, always a holy paladin for my tastes
in a 5 man, holy priest
why? raids you want to live, 5 mans, you want versatility
Post by
Lasthitlarry
I really like pallies healing me for sure, but man, druids are awesome too, all those HoTs....
Priests aren't bad, but they always end up shielding me...
The main person that heals me currently is a resto shaman, which I think is the worst possible choice :(
Post by
blademeld
I find that shamans aren't as effective as other healers with same item level and same player skill level... but they are doable.
priests are ok with me since the shield is gone after 2-3 seconds anyways >.>
Post by
Greatbrae
Any healer is ncie in my opinion, as long as my mana stays up. And there's a shadow preist there with the healer, infinite mana ftw.
Post by
106217
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
As restoration I'll outheal a holy paladin in five-mans any day of the week. The lack of any type of AoE heal really makes any extra mana efficiency a paladin provides moot.
how many AoE mobs are out there?
not a lot, that's why resto shamans don't do as well, but you are right, paladins severly lack AoE heals and that makes a difference
Post by
106217
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
My single target healing doesn't lack when I'm the sole healer.
as a paladin tank, you're going after 4-8 mobs without CC
2 medium geared healers, paladin and shaman,
in a spam heal situation, which happens pretty often with a bad pull
the shaman can easily fail here
I'm speaking from my own experience, simliar geared healers...
Earth Shield and Healing Wave does fine for just healing the tank and grants more flexability than Holy Light or Flash of Light spam.
I don't see how that provides more flexibility...
lesser healing wave = FoL
greater healing wave = HL
earth shield = blessing of light
(yes you're BoL on the paladin tank because he can BoK himself)
In five man's it's all about "Oh crap!" buttons and outside of Divine Shield paladins really just don't have any.
and how many do shamans have?
holy paladin = divine shield, holy shock, BoP, LoH
more than enough imo
Post by
106217
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
So Blessing of Light heals your target even when you need to drop healing him and start healing someone else? It provides extra threat to your tank? Blessing of Light doesn't even come close to comparing to Earth Shield.
Flash of Light and Lesser Healing Wave are also not equal. I can burst more with Lesser Healing Wave than Flash of Light ever will even with Blessing of Light up. It's less mana efficient but in the facet of where you need that kind of heal, (quick, burst healing) Lesser Healing Wave is superior.
sorry, I should have been more clear here
I meant it in terms of number of choices, not as in the difference of abilities themselves
Divine Shield and Blessing of Protection are "Oh shit!" buttons, sure(Restricted in the situation though, I might add. Useful but only if the mob is going to you for DS and only if a pure melee mob is heading to a non-tank member for BoP and then hoping the next highest in threat isn't another party member). I'm not giving you the other two though.
You haven't listed the shaman oh shit buttons as I have asked you
Holy Shock - About 1k instant heal from what I understand, you can gurantee it crits if you use your Divine Favor for 1.5k I suppose. Still that pales in comparison to the 4-7.5k I'm getting from a NS/Healing Wave. Similar timers as well, two minutes on yours to three minutes on mine.
Holy shock has a 15 second cooldown...
makes up for the lack of healing power
Lay on Hands - Honestly? Really? It's a 40 minute cooldown with talents (I would not consider my reincarnation an "Oh shit!" button due to the fact that I'll get maybe one use out of it for an instances duration, maybe)
reincarnation is not a "oh shit" button, it's a wipe recovery tool that is very versatile
albeit more useful than divine intervention
and drains your mana entirely for a heal that is only equal to your total health. In a PvE situation your health is going to be what, 8k in the level of gear we're talking about? That's an instant heal once every 40 minutes that is equivilant to a guranteed crit, instant, Healing Wave.
3 things:
you also get armor bonus and mana from LoH, much more useful for a paladin tank than a Healing wave
and you can use this with 0 mana, whereas you can't with a healing wave
this can crit up to 12k with 8k HP
Nice in the situation where you are completely oom and that 8k heal is going to be enough for the group to finish a mob off, but how often does that happen?
You'd be suprised at what a protection paladin can do with 8k HP and 2k mana
I know it's saved me a lot of times in a boss fight after the DPS died off
I really don't want to get in a twelve page argument with you but I don't know anyone that would take a holy paladin over a restoration shaman specifically for a five man PvE instance.
This would be fine if it were true; but in my experience as both a tank and DPS and when chatting with friends, associates, and the like, everyone I've spoken with dislikes paladin healers for five mans if they can get anyone else to fill the role.
Different servers and different people = different preferences
I have yet to meet anyone who prefers resto shaman over holy paladin in my realm
That statement came across to me as if shaman were some kind of pity-case healers that you would only ever take along if you really couldn't find any other healer.
my apologies if that was the message you got
what I meant was that they are capable as any other healer in a 5 man through versatility rather than a holy paladin's efficiency
Post by
108698
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
89501
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Lasthitlarry
I just love paladin healers when compared with shaman healers, though if it was anything other than a 5 man, I wouldn't mind a shaman AND a paladin healing me :)
Healadins:
Blessing of Light
Improved Devotion Aura (usually)
Crit +6% on Holy Light
Crit +5% on Holy spells
100% chance to reduce next Holy Light cast time by 0.5
+10% Intellect
35% of Intellect goes to +Healing
+12% healing to Flash of Light and Holy Light
100% Chance to gain 60% mana from their critical heals
Blessing of Protection
Lay on hands
Holy Shock (Instant)
-50% mana cost on all spells for 15 seconds (3 min cooldown)
Instant Critical Heal spell (2 min cooldown)
And if all else fails: Plate armor :)
Post by
zoomie
So Blessing of Light heals your target even when you need to drop healing him and start healing someone else? It provides extra threat to your tank? Blessing of Light doesn't even come close to comparing to Earth Shield.
Flash of Light and Lesser Healing Wave are also not equal. I can burst more with Lesser Healing Wave than Flash of Light ever will even with Blessing of Light up. It's less mana efficient but in the facet of where you need that kind of heal, (quick, burst healing) Lesser Healing Wave is superior.
sorry, I should have been more clear here
I meant it in terms of number of choices, not as in the difference of abilities themselves
Divine Shield and Blessing of Protection are "Oh shit!" buttons, sure(Restricted in the situation though, I might add. Useful but only if the mob is going to you for DS and only if a pure melee mob is heading to a non-tank member for BoP and then hoping the next highest in threat isn't another party member). I'm not giving you the other two though.
You haven't listed the shaman oh shit buttons as I have asked you
Holy Shock - About 1k instant heal from what I understand, you can gurantee it crits if you use your Divine Favor for 1.5k I suppose. Still that pales in comparison to the 4-7.5k I'm getting from a NS/Healing Wave. Similar timers as well, two minutes on yours to three minutes on mine.
Holy shock has a 15 second cooldown...
makes up for the lack of healing power
Lay on Hands - Honestly? Really? It's a 40 minute cooldown with talents (I would not consider my reincarnation an "Oh shit!" button due to the fact that I'll get maybe one use out of it for an instances duration, maybe)
reincarnation is not a "oh shit" button, it's a wipe recovery tool that is very versatile
albeit more useful than divine intervention
and drains your mana entirely for a heal that is only equal to your total health. In a PvE situation your health is going to be what, 8k in the level of gear we're talking about? That's an instant heal once every 40 minutes that is equivilant to a guranteed crit, instant, Healing Wave.
3 things:
you also get armor bonus and mana from LoH, much more useful for a paladin tank than a Healing wave
and you can use this with 0 mana, whereas you can't with a healing wave
this can crit up to 12k with 8k HP
Nice in the situation where you are completely oom and that 8k heal is going to be enough for the group to finish a mob off, but how often does that happen?
You'd be suprised at what a protection paladin can do with 8k HP and 2k mana
I know it's saved me a lot of times in a boss fight after the DPS died off
I really don't want to get in a twelve page argument with you but I don't know anyone that would take a holy paladin over a restoration shaman specifically for a five man PvE instance.
This would be fine if it were true; but in my experience as both a tank and DPS and when chatting with friends, associates, and the like, everyone I've spoken with dislikes paladin healers for five mans if they can get anyone else to fill the role.
Different servers and different people = different preferences
I have yet to meet anyone who prefers resto shaman over holy paladin in my realm
That statement came across to me as if shaman were some kind of pity-case healers that you would only ever take along if you really couldn't find any other healer.
my apologies if that was the message you got
what I meant was that they are capable as any other healer in a 5 man through versatility rather than a holy paladin's efficiency
Sorry to quote such a big quote but there are too many things you are not looking at. First off, reincarnate can be an oh shit button. What if a boss is at 3% health? Why wipe when you can come back and throw a heal or two while that last little bit of health ticks off? Though it is mostly wipe recovery, it has its place during a fight.
This part just makes me wonder if you even have a brain -
3 things:
you also get armor bonus and mana from LoH, much more useful for a paladin tank than a Healing wave
and you can use this with 0 mana, whereas you can't with a healing wave
this can crit up to 12k with 8k HP
If you get the armor bonus from your lay on hands then you have way too many points in holy (you should have 0 at most). And what good is a crit lay on hands? It heals what a pallys max health is. So like you said if I had 8k HP I can crit 12k but what good is it when im only healing 8k health. It is a guaranteed full health recovery with or without a crit so why brag about a stupid crit?
From your other posts I can tell you are either a noob, half retarded, or misguided. Not EVERYONE knows how to play their class. You can not sit there and tell me that as you played you have NEVER seen someone who was a complete idiot and didn't know how to play their class. I used to think a paladin couldn't heal for shit but thats because the few paladins I had healing my groups were retarded! Just because you group with a few shammys doesn't mean they know what they are doing. But you probably can't spot someone who thinks they know how to play when they are totally clueless, because you are one.
And another thing. Did anyone ever bring up totems? No they aren't a direct heal but if used right they can be a huge help to the group
Post by
blademeld
Sorry to quote such a big quote but there are too many things you are not looking at.
edit the quotes like i do?
First off, reincarnate can be an oh shit button.
that's what i meant by versatility
If you get the armor bonus from your lay on hands then you have way too many points in holy.
we're discussing the holy paladin healing a protection paladin, not protection healing himself... end of discussion for this part and your next 2 points
From your other posts I can tell you are either a noob, half retarded, or misguided. Not EVERYONE knows how to play their class. You can not sit there and tell me that as you played you have NEVER seen someone who was a complete idiot and didn't know how to play their class.
that's exactly what you're doing as far as i'm concerned
I used to think a paladin couldn't heal for shit but thats because the few paladins I had healing my groups were retarded! Just because you group with a few shammys doesn't mean they know what they are doing. But you probably can't spot someone who thinks they know how to play when they are totally clueless, because you are one.
both paladin and shaman healers were at entry raid level and both had good words input from thier friends.
like i said, it's not their skill that's lacking, it's just that I can hold aggro and the healer need only to heal me instead of an AoE heal, and clearly paladins are superior at that.
I believe my example of a multi-mob tanking was decent enough to cover that point
And another thing. Did anyone ever bring up totems? No they aren't a direct heal but if used right they can be a huge help to the group
yes, but so can a paladin's blessings
strength of earth = blessing of might
mana spring totem = blessing of wisdom, etc.
but paladins only need to do it once 30 min, whereas shamans are 2 min/totem
I believe that my points were concise and consistant, bashing me doesn't do any good overall, now, please cut it here.
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