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What exactly is a "threat" set
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349103
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Post by
zoomie
Just to point out a few things.
Shield of righteousness is our biggest threat stat, and it is modified by block value. So the higher your block value, the higher your hardest hitting threat ability is.
Strength also increases block value, but strength also increases attack power. Concecrate, seals, judgements, hammer of the righteous, and I think even holy shield is affected by attack power. So block value increases only your shield slam, but strength increases everything else. And for those of you who are going to say hammer of the righteous is not affected by by attack power because the tooltip says weapon damage, I have two words for you: your wrong.
Whoever it was that said we get a ton of threat based off mobs hitting us, can you please stop posting from The Burning Crusade? We don't want to get hit, period. Holy shield is such a small portion of our threat now, and unless there is a ret pally in the group/raid then you wont have retribution aura. Even if there was, you wouldn't notice the threat increase from it. With that said, don't EVER drop dodge or parry to pick up block for the purposes of gaining threat. Look at hammer of the righteous and shield of righteousness as your 2 huge threat abilities.
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Post by
Dunsinane
Okay, there's a lot of half-accurate claims and some confused terms in this thread.
A threat set is simply a gearset that emphasizes your ability to generate threat and dps rather than health, avoidance, or mitigation. The distinction was much greater back in BC, when there was a much sharper divide between mitigation pieces and threat pieces.
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For other definitions:
Avoidance - your ability to completely avoid being struck by a physical attack. This is the sum of your miss % + dodge % + parry % after diminishing returns and is affected by defense rating, dodge rating, parry rating, and agility.
Mitigation - your ability to reduce incoming physical damage. This includes avoidance, but also your block % and block value. It is affected by defense rating, dodge rating, parry rating, block rating, block value, agility and strength.
Damage Reduction - how much you further reduce the damage taken from an attack after it has gotten past your miss/dodge/parry/block. Against physical attacks, this is a matter of armor and some talents and buffs. Against magical attacks, this is a matter of talents, buffs and magic resistances.
Block Rating - increases your chance of blocking an attack.
Block Value - increases the amount your successful blocks mitigate.
Other than Block Value, none of these have any significant effect on your threat.
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In WotLK, a threat set for a paladin will stack Block Value and Strength while not dipping below uncrittable. This is because most of our threat abilities gain the most from Strength. BV is secondary, but strong in conjunction with Shield of Righteousness.
Of the two neckpieces listed, the Medallion of the Disgraced is significantly superior for threat and effective health. The Pendant of the Nathrezim has a slight edge in pure avoidance.
Yes, you can vendor the Pendant.
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As a Paladin we want mobs to hit us
No. We don't. That was a bad strategy back in Karazhan. It is a worse strategy now. Holy Shield and Retribution Aura are a tiny and unreliable portion of our threat generation, and Spiritual Attunement is no longer the sole means of mana regeneration.
Block sets are strong in Naxxramas and Heroic 5-mans simply because most bosses and mobs hit very softly in relation to the amount of BV we can stack. As the amount of damage per swing increases, the importance of avoiding those swings grows proportionately.
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Numbers:
2 Strength = 1 BV
1 Strength = 2 AP (before talents and buffs)
14 AP = 1 weapon DPS (affects white damage and HotR)
16.4 Block Rating = 1% Block
4.92 Defense Rating = 1 Defense Skill
1 Defense Skill = .04% to each of Miss/Dodge/Parry/Block
31 Defense Rating = 1% to Miss/Dodge/Parry/Block COMBINED
41 Defense Rating = 1% to Miss/Dodge/Parry COMBINED
39.4 Dodge Rating = 1% Dodge
49.2 Parry Rating = 1% Parry
535 Defense Skill = 665 Defense rating = uncrittable by level 82 mobs (Heroic 5-man bosses)
540 Defense Skill = 689 Defense rating = uncrittable by level 83 mobs (Raid bosses)
With regards to avoidance, Defense rating, Dodge rating, and Parry rating are all subject to diminishing returns - i.e. the more you stack, the less benefit you gain from further stacking.
They are also on separate diminishing return scales - i.e., the parry you gain from Defense rating does not affect the parry you gain from Parry rating and vice versa.
Bonuses gained through talents and racials are not subject to diminishing returns. Block rating is not subject to diminishing returns.
Post by
288472
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Post by
Tuberon
There are 2 main "set concepts" for paladins.
Avoidance set, which is your common "don't get hit" set, full of things like stamina, dodge, parry, block...
Threat set, which is your common "we outgear this content badly so I need every bit of threat I can get" full of strength, block value, candy.
A fully Uld25 geared paladin tanking Naxx10 with his other Uld25 guildies has more use for a threat set than an avoidance set. Those mages and ret pallies and such are going to be putting out a fair bit of threat.
Naxx25 geared paladin wandering into Uld10 with his Naxx25 guildies is going to want his avoidance set, conversely. Those bosses are going to be hitting hard.
Post by
Dunsinane
if you need to dodge all the time to survive the encounter, then you shouldn't be there in first place.
Maybe I should have been more clear on this but mob=trash on this
By your own admission, you've yet to run into the Uld25 Chuck Norris Gnomes. Or the golems. Or the Ignis trash pre-nerf or...
Yeah. Suffice to say, Uld25 trash hits harder than T7 bosses, and 2k BV isn't worth much against 20k hits. But if you're only doing 10 mans, then you likely won't see a major difference.
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