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Subtlety VS Combat
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Post by
59551
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
sYs73m
http://www.wowhead.com/?forums&board=5
Take a look at the first 927962738572956723 threads. :)
Just kidding. Remx will be here shortly with his builds and reasonings, that I'm sure by now are saved in a text file.
Post by
68244
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
105540
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Remx
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=f0ebovZMIVobVzxMGot
Post by
Kryz
By no means should you go by what someone else says. There are a lot of high and mighty rogues that will only spec combat, and anyone who doesn't is a noob who doesn't know what they're doing. If someone sounds too committed to one tree, it's because they are, and they won't give you a good overall view because they're too busy stroking their epeens.
I personally do prefer combat because of the more sustainable damage in groups, and more options while solo questing. That being said, I can completely understand the appeal of sub. Shadowstep isn't something to be written off as a throw away talent. Besides the obvious fun factor (this is a game right?), it's a nice damage boost for huge ambush crits, and with the upcoming change where it will add a combo point, its group use is going up.
I'm currently using:
https://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fhe0oxZMeEz0VzVMhot
I took fist over sword simply because I can't get my hands on a good sword to use.
Post by
Remx
and with the upcoming change where it will add a combo point, its group use is going up.
That change poses problems too though. If you need to use shadowstep on a target other than your current one, for whatever reason (this may seem an unlikely action, but I assure you the need can arise more often than you might think), you will lose your combo points.
It's not necessarily a bad change, it's just a strange one. There's plenty of other options they could consider exploring in order to buff shadowstep (it still does need buffing, or balancing if you prefer).
Post by
sYs73m
and with the upcoming change where it will add a combo point, its group use is going up.
That change poses problems too though. If you need to use shadowstep on a target other than your current one, for whatever reason (this may seem an unlikely action, but I assure you the need can arise more often than you might think), you will lose your combo points.
It's not necessarily a bad change, it's just a strange one. There's plenty of other options they could consider exploring in order to buff shadowstep (it still does need buffing, or balancing if you prefer).
This point right here is the
exact
thought I had when I heard of the change. This really only adds to the Rogue argument that we should have "Combo Points" build up on the Rogue itself to use, not the target in which we have selected/are building points upon. Could be construed as overpowered, but I disagree.
Post by
106553
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Wildhorn
Combat has an AoE cooldown, shorter Evasion and Sprint cooldowns, an extra snare break, an energy regeneration cooldown, and more options out of stealth.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fZ0eVbbZxMxcMGRsxst
Has a raid melee-damage buff, shorter Vanish and Blind and Evasion and Sprint, an extra snare break, 10% more AP, less chance to get hit, a stronger DoT, more damage on oppening and finishing moves and more option in stealth.
Subtlety has more useless talents than the other 2 trees combined, and is only used to get to either Hemorrhage or Preparation. Any rogue that takes Shadowstep is gimping themselves, but most just take it for the "zomg teleport pew pew" factor anyway.
Combat has more useless talents than the other 2 trees combined, and is only used to get Adrenaline Rush or Blade Furry. Any rogue taking Surprise Attacks is gimping themselves, but most take it for "zomg no dodge pew pew" factor anyway.
I'd suggest Combat, getting used to it is your best bet, because Hemorrhage is getting nerfed.
And if you want to go Subtlety for the Improved Ambush and the big numbers, don't. You'll hit 70 and realize you suck, and will have to adapt a new playing style. It's not worth it.
I'd suggest Subtely, getting used to it is your best bet, because Blade Furry break CC around you.
And if you want to go Combat for the Riposte and have no use in party/raid, don't You'll hit 70 and realize you suck, and will have to adapt a new playing style. It's not worth it.
Post by
Wildhorn
and with the upcoming change where it will add a combo point, its group use is going up.
That change poses problems too though. If you need to use shadowstep on a target other than your current one, for whatever reason (this may seem an unlikely action, but I assure you the need can arise more often than you might think), you will lose your combo points.
It's not necessarily a bad change, it's just a strange one. There's plenty of other options they could consider exploring in order to buff shadowstep (it still does need buffing, or balancing if you prefer).
This point right here is the
exact
thought I had when I heard of the change. This really only adds to the Rogue argument that we should have "Combo Points" build up on the Rogue itself to use, not the target in which we have selected/are building points upon. Could be construed as overpowered, but I disagree.
1) Why would you use Shadowstep on another target?
2) Yes it would be OP, build 5 combo points on critters (like rats at AB farm) and open up with already 5 combo points.
3) To fix it they would just need to change it so "Next special attack that add combo point will generate an extra combo point"
Post by
Remx
Wildhorn, some of your opinions are awfully skewed.
Combat has more useless talents than the other 2 trees combined, and is only used to get Adrenaline Rush or Blade Furry. Any rogue taking Surprise Attacks is gimping themselves, but most take it for "zomg no dodge pew pew" factor anyway.
And if you want to go Combat for the Riposte and have no use in party/raid, don't You'll hit 70 and realize you suck, and will have to adapt a new playing style. It's not worth it.
BZZZZZZT.
Yes it would be OP, build 5 combo points on critters (like rats at AB farm) and open up with already 5 combo points.
AB is serious business.
Opening up with 5 combo points isn't much of a deal anyway, that's only two more than a cheap shot with initiative. Either way, there's nothing incredibly overpowered about it. Going out of your way to build combo points before a fight in order to begin with an extremely mild advantage would be more of a hassle than it was worth. If they were really concerned about, they could simply add a timer for combo point expiry, 60 seconds maybe? At any rate it would be impossible to abuse in the arena; combo points are wiped on entry.
There's plenty of reasons you could want to shadowstep to another target, to get in range of a healer that has just come out of a now fully diminished CC and is preparing to heal the group's target for example. I won't prepare a list, I'll rely on you to do a little thinking for yourself.
Combo points have nothing to do with the fix that shadowstep needs.
Post by
Wildhorn
Wildhorn, some of your opinions are awfully skewed.
Combat has more useless talents than the other 2 trees combined, and is only used to get Adrenaline Rush or Blade Furry. Any rogue taking Surprise Attacks is gimping themselves, but most take it for "zomg no dodge pew pew" factor anyway.
And if you want to go Combat for the Riposte and have no use in party/raid, don't You'll hit 70 and realize you suck, and will have to adapt a new playing style. It's not worth it.
BZZZZZZT.
Was a rant about Curse-icon
Yes it would be OP, build 5 combo points on critters (like rats at AB farm) and open up with already 5 combo points.
AB is serious business.
Opening up with 5 combo points isn't much of a deal anyway, that's only two more than a cheap shot with initiative. Either way, there's nothing incredibly overpowered about it. Going out of your way to build combo points before a fight in order to begin with an extremely mild advantage would be more of a hassle than it was worth. If they were really concerned about, they could simply add a timer for combo point expiry, 60 seconds maybe? At any rate it would be impossible to abuse in the arena; combo points are wiped on entry.
There's plenty of reasons you could want to shadowstep to another target, to get in range of a healer that has just come out of a now fully diminished CC and is preparing to heal the group's target for example. I won't prepare a list, I'll rely on you to do a little thinking for yourself.
Combo points have nothing to do with the fix that shadowstep needs.
yeah ok, shadowstepping to a healer might be useful
I didnt say what i said would totaly fix shadowstep. I said it would fix the combo point part.
EDIT: Of course AB is serious buzness
Post by
107764
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Remx
dude go combat sub is worthless premeditation is the worst 31 point talent preparation has a 10 minute Cd and usually isn't there when you need it(such in bg's) shadowstep is good if your chasing someone who is a druid/shaman/hunter/mage. ghostly strike takes to much time building that much energy for a 15% dodge buff but why even go into it because in the heat of combat your trying to obliterate your enemy the fastest not wait for your 50 energy skill to come up.
On the other hand SS isn't that good without getting the energy cost reduced. riposte shows warriors that they can't do shit against you. Blade furry is good for when you got slice and dice up. adreneline rush i honestly don't think its good in pvp unless your target isn't moving and suprise attacks is good against when your trying to escape from some asshole who is ganking you.
combat>sub but i still went assasination for mut.
I don't think you made a single correct point in that entire post.
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