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Paladin is still the underdog of Tanking
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Post by
BoJlk
When it comes to tanking i enjoy tanking as a paladin but when it come to Profession choice and armor set bonuses we're still "
under development
"
if you were DPS you would compare your recount statistics on Patchwerk. When you are tanking you'll be showing off with your HP pull, "
look how much i have
" it's a silly comparison but still true.
Compare the Four Tanking classes, who's tanking Sartharion with 3 Drakes? a Druid with 55k+ HP pull not the Paladin with 40% Block...
I choose my gear under great inspection before wearing and enchanting.
Conserving Avoidance versus HP ratio.
I'm proud of my gear choice but i've saw a paladin the other day with 32k hp unbuffed when I'm reaching 30k.
The other Paladin was stuffing every slot with jewecrafting 41 stamina stone ignoring slot bonuses and wearing anything he likes even the 7.5 set i'm avoiding (gaining only 500 but loosing 1.5% avoidense and block rating with only two pieces for me)
The Slot bonuses were designed for only one role, tanking.
So i have to choose a specific profession if i want to be a tank or be any good for it.
Post by
ArgentSun
Maybe. But I disagree, we are not the underdogs anymore. In fact, we are pretty well sought tanks. It is true that Block isn't very useful, but Blizzard are thinking about redesigning it - they goal is for Block to be something between the passive damage reduction of Armor, and the RNG-based complete avoidance of Dodge/Parry.
Another point I disagree at - the only reason druids and DKs are tanking Sarth 3D is because the encounter was made poorly, and Blizzard developers have admitted that multiple times. All of the end-game encounters now (Sartharion, Malygos, Archavon, and Kel'Thuzad) were designed to be very friendly towards DKs and Druids (the first 3 are slow hitters for huge amounts of damage, i.e. Block unfriendly, and KT is a magic encounter). With 3.1 things should be a lot better for us and warriors alike.
Post by
293902
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
BoJlk
the thing that was strange to me is when i compared DK guildy and my own HP.
I have the same amount of stamina and the Talent percents added to the amount ending up me missing few thousandth, i won't talk about warriors being the MT in most of the Guilds.
Being the natural role of Tanking and Main Tanking.
Now this sounds like an usual "whine" or "Nerf warriors" but it's far from it.
I like Warrior tanking and love tanking as a Paladin, I've Tanked since L30 and Pre WOTLK and the Changes made us very Popular DPSers and Strong Tanks.
I get the feeling that something is wrong. When you choose to be a tank you must have Jewecrafting and it's best to ignore slot Bonuses because they were designed not to be very useful.
atm it's pretty equal with druids coming in last, but in 3.1 we'll be #1 when it comes to tanking (overall). As for the HP issue, yea, it's part of life. The noob will stack stam and pugs will love him. You on the other hand should find a good guild and not worry about the noobs.
I'm in a very Progression hungry\Hard Core Guild and my comparison with the "other" Paladin that was a part of other Hard Core guild.
He wosn't a "noob" but made a desicion to be the best Tank for his Guild and Choose a specific Profession and Stacking those 41 stamina stone was the ability he "abused" to his advantage.
The Advantage that was made possible by Blizzard, somehow making you choose a Jewecrafting as more suitable Profession to have if you decide to Tank as your Carrier.
Post by
65116
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Post by
232756
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Post by
Quest
People that think Paladins are underdogs in -any- respect right now ever played them in vanilla.
I healed, tanked, and did dps.
DPS and tanking batteled for the crown of 'hardest to be not worthless at'. Healing is pretty much the same. Spam x heal forever, except now we dont have downranking.
DPS I was only good at because I was near full pvp gear. This was years before resilience. Me and my trusty unstoppable force plowed through many-a-troll. CS was a dream back then.
Tanking...
....
Yeah, holy shield. Consecration. That was about it along with SoR+SotC judged. Rotations? Taunts? lolerstakes Silly paladin, bossess are for warriors! We needed like half a min to generate enough aggro, and even then the healer would be riding your ass for top TPS.
If you think tanking for us right now is difficult in any way, youre just bad. Sorry.
Post by
BoJlk
thanks
nospin29
That actually made me feel better, since WOTLK i never heard "let's try it while you tank" when joining a group, just "wow" =)
P.S
You forgot about the +50 Stamina Mining bonus added with the JC.
As a proud Alchemist who got his profession from my premain who got his from his premain i got
Indestructible Alchemist's Stone
against the JC stones.
"this is officially became a whine post"
=(
Post by
Nazeka
Mining bonus kicks in *only* if you also mine. My tankadin is a JC/Alch so no free stam for me outside of the trinkets/JC-gems
Post by
BoJlk
If you think tanking for us right now is difficult in any way
Never said that, i'm proud to be Paladin Tank and doing a god damn good job at it, was able to steal Aggro from my MT once...=)
This is a Vanilla Age for Paladins, we're Kings now.
The Popular Choice for DPS, Heal and Tank.
Somehow there's still only three Classe who really tank, DK only DPS and PVP right now.
If i started to whine let me do it properly: if you would ask me what should you choose when creating a new Character for yourself wanting to tank in the future i would say, pick a Paladin and Jewecrafting+Mining for your profession.
I'm whining about the fact that i'll be right suggesting a specific profession with other Tanking tips.
Post by
fenom
The problem is you are looking at tanking as biggest health pool=best tank.
Let me say as a former feral tank this isn't true sure I had over 30k unbuffed even in heroic gear but this makes ferals the best option for only sarth +
Try not to focus to much on comparing stats between tank classes.
-didn't see it before but DKs aren't just DPS and PvP they actually make great tanks
Post by
svirve
Now now, you havn't really looked into the facts here.
Blizzard made sure that all of the proffessions are very balanced with WotLK.
And i mean VERY balance at the most it'll differ 1-2 points of AP or the like.
Let me break it down for you:
Alchemy: Double duration on pots/flasks. Finding numbers on mixology is hard some suggest a 20% increase to stats other a 50% increase. But the facts i've seen suggest the same increase as in the other proffessions
Blacksmithing: 48 stam or 32 to another stat/rating.
Enchanting: 48 stam or 64 AP
Engineering: This is probably the only long-term bad choice. it has nothing special except being cool.
Herbalism: A 2000 heal over 5 seconds aint much but it's off the GCD so put it in your panic button
Inscription: Gives you the best shoulder enchants and easy access to darkmoon cards and glyphs. 32 dodge.
Jewelcrafting: 48 to stam or 33 to another stat/rating.
Leatherworking: 40 stam
Mining: 50 more stam
Skinning: 25 crit rating.
Tailoring:
This
or
this
both pretty worthless.
The reason to why JC/BS is the best combo is because: You will almost never have to neglect a slot bonus, if your gear doesnt have 3 gem slots (which is HIGHLY unlikely) for your JC specific gems BS will give you 2 extra slots, the BS slots are prismatic so you can gem for what you want. And the list goes on.
But blizz has been pretty good at making sure that just because you choose a certain profession you dont get any worse at doing what you do. With some exceptions.
Post by
293902
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Post by
329396
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Post by
MischievousLoki
I sympathize with you. There are far too many people out there who have no idea how to gear a tank. Mostly it's non-tanks who don't but not always. Anyway, because of this, all people look at is max HP and crit-immunity.
Granted, max HP does help, but in the long run, once you've got enough HP to survive a couple hits (or one hit in the case of patchwerk), it's all about trying not to get hit very often. Sure druids can get an insane amount of HP to tank OS+3D, but I bet the smart druids who want to MT everything else put on more dodge and less stamina when they're not in OS.
Also, maybe I'm confused, but you said he was stuffing EVERY slot with prismatic gems (unique-equipped 3) and ignoring socket bonuses (fills any color requirement)? Exaggeration gets you no where. :/
Post by
BoJlk
I didn't mean that if you have the most HP = you're the best tank.
if we compare between the classes abit, as far as i understand Warrior have the same amount of Avoidance as other classes, DK are missing Block but have a massive amount of Parry and Dodge which compensate for the lack of Block, Druids have no Parry nor Block but a massive amount of Mitigation and Dodge which will reach the same amount of overall Avoidance as other Tanks.
Around 55-56% i'm guessing (not raid buffed).
So after you carefully selected your Gear to reach a good HP vs Avoidence ratio you start looking for ways to increase your HP pull.
That's when you notices the Changes between the Classes.
I mean a Warrior with a Tier 7 + Naxx 10 gear will have 30-31k unbuffed, when i'll have a little less with Naxx 25 and T7.5
Let me present my
Armory
(Avoidence gear)
I'm standing at 55% Avoidense and almost 30k if i change my gear to Tier 7.5 i'll be at 30k but much lower Avoidence which will do only harm.
Post by
230625
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Post by
193348
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Post by
BoJlk
Did u see the video at mmo-champion where they kill Sartharion with 3 drakes in 76secs?
Guess who's tanking there.
A protadin....
Sartharion 10 maybe
i would like a link for that movie
another thing bothers me is Paladin gets
Libram of Obstruction
Warrior gets
Armor Plated Combat Shotgun
Post by
293902
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