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Is it Possible to Rate SKILL
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Post by
windstrum
Are achievements not enough?
Nothing is 100%, but achievements give you a good idea of whether or not someone is capable. Not to say a lack of achievements makes somebody utterly trash - there's obviously many reasons why someone would be lacking achievements. But at least you know there's a risk involved in taking said person along.
Well, there's a mage I know (kinda used to be friends) on my realm, Twilight Vanquisher, like 2580 gear score. My friend Thomas ran ToCr with him on his mage (2400 gear score), and out-DPSed him on each boss by over 1k, and also survived every fight whereas the other mage died nearly every time.
So no, I personally don't feel achievements mean anything.
While your opinion is completely valid, the example you provide says nothing about skill. The mage could just as easily have been being played by somebody else using that WoW account, or by someone who was drunk/tired/sick/unfocused.
I still argue that achievements are as good as anything for judging skill. There are many, many things that affect how well someone will perform in a given instance on a given day, that nothing electronic will ever be able to predict.
I disagree because the idea of using achievements for basing skill just leads to raid leaders requiring that people have the achievement to do the raid, which leads to the issue of people who have never done the raid being unable to do the raid and people on alts unable to bring an alt.
Well, no. Those are people using achievements incorrectly (in my opinion at least). How about for entry level raids, raid leaders check to make sure the person has cleared all heroics 5mans, or something equally tangible?
For example, for a Naxx run I don't need to find people who have cleared Naxx. If they have vent, the gear required supported by a decent talent spec, and can show me they've a least done a decent amount of work in heroics, then I'm happy to bring them along and show them some of the content. People need to be given a chance.
Post by
MischievousLoki
Overall Player Performance = Dedication * ( Skill + Gear + Knowledge ) / Content Difficulty
Take that as you will.
EDIT: Dedication includes time spent playing.
Post by
Orranis
Are achievements not enough?
Nothing is 100%, but achievements give you a good idea of whether or not someone is capable. Not to say a lack of achievements makes somebody utterly trash - there's obviously many reasons why someone would be lacking achievements. But at least you know there's a risk involved in taking said person along.
Skill not meaning how much they've cleared, but how good they are at it. I've barely finished Naxxaramas because I'm 13 and can't play for many hours at a time, have a hell of a chaotic schedule, so basically a life (Not to mention parents who don't understand I can't just pause the game and let them check their E-mail), yet I'm still considered one of the better tanks on the server based on the fact that I don't just Death Grip and face-roll.
Post by
Orranis
Overall Player Performance = Amount of free hours you have (Free not including social hours)
* ( Skill (Lolwtf this what we trying to figure out.)
+ Gear (Essentially dedication, or how I interpreted it)
+ Knowledge (Amount of time you spend doing what you're supposed to do (I.E. Not standing in fire) )
/Content Difficulty
Take that as you will.
EDIT: Dedication includes time spent playing.
My take on it. Not that great... Could have been handled a lot better.
Post by
Orranis
How about
Skill = Knowledge of fight mechanics (What you're required to do) + (Actual following of fight mechanics (How much you stay out of fire in actuality for example) / Encounter difficulty) + Knowledge of personal mechanics (Rotations, Priorities, Etc.)
Thoughts?
Post by
cosmicguen
Achievements are a decent way of filtering out the real crap, but they're not the perfect way of getting people who know what they're doing.
Theoretically, if I were to run pugs, I wouldn't ask people for the achievement for whatever we're doing. The only exception to this is if I'm planning to run Naxx for the arachnophobia, momma said, undying, etc - specific achievements. Then I'd expect you to have Fall of Naxxramas, or most of the bosses and be able to tell me the tactics for the ones you don't have.
If I was running an Ulduar pug I'd expect you to have a decent number of Naxx achievements, although I probably wouldn't be all that specific about it. Again, unless I'm going for specific Ulduar achievements, in which case show me you've cleared it.
Same again with ToC - Naxx and Uld achievements for an inv there, etc etc.
I wouldn't want any achievements for a heroic 5 man.
Again
unless we're going for
Glory
. Then I'd expect you to have at least cleared the places we're hitting.
Of course, if you were running an alt who didn't have the required achievements, and could physically log onto a main who did have them and link from there, I'd give your alt a shot.
And no, I wouldn't be getting a perfect group, I'm still open to morons who think we're happy to carry them. But smart use of the achievement system can be a decent filter and get you off on the right foot, so to speak.
Only way to rate skill is to observe, unfortunately.
Post by
73830
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161859
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391648
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Post by
MischievousLoki
My take on it. Not that great... Could have been handled a lot better.
You know how equations work, right? If you want to solve for one variable, isolate it. ;)
My intention was to separate the various things people were calling a measure of skill (i.e.: gear) into separate categories. Because in reality, skill is
how you use
what you're given, not
what
you're given.
Post by
391648
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Post by
alejbr4
case in point i was doing 25 nax on kt back in may on my ret pally, now i got booted from the raid for not doing enough dps before doing another raid. the reason i was low on dps was that one of the healers got nuked and i took up the healing for him which i rated in top 10 healing. Now i was rated purely on my dps not the fact i took up healing slack when someone died. and starting healing an off tank during the cryptlord phase. So like above all skill should be rated on what you do not what you have in gear or achievements, especially achievements because everyone has an alt.
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351418
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133410
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