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Horde vs Alliance
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Post by
R1TeR
Ive been wanting to make this for a while now and I was wondering if a war really broke out how would win,not lore wise or playing favories but tacticaly.Now lets look at the races
Alliance
Horde
Humans Orcs
Dwarfs Taruen
Night Elfs Undead
Gnomes Trolls
Draenei Blood Elfs
Worgen Goblins
Now everybody can say that 9 times out of 10 the Horde frontlines will win againest the Alliance frontlines.Even now that with the Worgen in the Alliance now there frontlines are a little better and with the Goblins now fully Horde the Hordes tech has been highly improved.
The Alliance range game is way better then the Hordes with the Humans being natural at anything and the Dwarfs riflemen also being good and the Night Elfs being some of the best archers around to only really the Blood Elfs having some fine archers as well.So you can say that the Alliance ranged game will eat up the Hordes frontlines before then can get close.
Now tech wise the Alliance has long been more advanced then the Horde, but now that the Goblins are with the Horde now they are somewhat on par with the alliance but not quite there as the
dwarfs are no slackers in tech and Humans having basic knowledge of it.
Now lets look at the racial leaders
Alliance
Horde
Varian Wrynn Thrall
Magni Bronzebeard Cairne Bloodhoof
Tyrande Whisperwind(Malfurion Stromrage) Sylvanas Windrunner
Gelbin Mekkatorgue Vol Jin
Velen Lor'themar Theron (current i think)
Gren Graymane (dont know for the goblins)
Now all of them are great in there own right none really having the advantage over each other.
For me this is to close to really call who would win each having there own pros and cons, but who do you think would win and why?
Post by
taurenmoo812
However anyone its going to shape this argument is going to be based purely on self opinion of which side they like the most and why they think the otherside is weaker then they are.
It would be like going to a football match with two teams that were even in there seasonal wins, and yet the supporters of one team will always say there side is bound to win.
Both sides in warcraft is neutral, one isn't better then the other, there is no good guys vs bad guys anymore for these two factions.
Post by
Skreeran
I'm not sure who would win between the entire factions. There's so many variables. Who attacked first? Are the Forsaken using the Blight? Where are they fighting?
So I'm just going to do the faction leader's part for now:
In a fight:
Varian < Thrall. Thrall is roughly as skilled a gladiator as Varian, but he also he the greatest Shaman to ever live.
Magni > Cairne, I would say. Cairne is much older, relatively, than Magni, and is probably as good a fighter as Varian, considering that Varian was trained by a Dwarf, and Arthas was trained by Magni's brother.
Tyrande < Sylvanas, I think, but not by much. Sylvanas is undead, and can take a lot more hits that Tyrande. Not to mention that Tyrande constantly seems to be needing Malfurion to come out and help her any time there's trouble. Now, if Malfurion woke up, he'd beat Sylvanas easy.
Mekkatorque < Vol'jin. Vol'jin hasn't done much, but Mekkatorque is tiny, has no discernible combat skills, and essentially nuked his own people to get rid of Troggs.
Velen < Lor'Themar, although I doubt they'd fight. Velen is mighty in the light, but he's also frail and vulnerable, and we haven't really seen him fight. The Draenei would probably hide him away as they did in the Draenor War. This one is up for debate.
And no, I totally didn't mean to give the Alliance one victory, I was trying to remain as objective as possible.
Post by
361041
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Patty
Velen wouldn't fight. He wants to unite the Races for the Naaru's Army of Light.
Post by
HiVolt
Well, conflicts like this would play out very differently depending on many factors. We need to take location into account, size of force, training, possibility of reinforcement, third-party action or inaction, and a whole slew of other various factors to make a suitable judgment on this.
In a battlefield type situation, where there are evenly matched armies, no retreats, no reinforcements, no third-party action, equal training, and no real advantage due to location, it would be a complete toss up. Honestly, I think the Horde would be more likely to win based on the ability of each individual soldier, but the Alliance often has better strategic movement, and could win in that respect.
For now, I'll say stalemate, unless we delve into the deeper ideas of combat between two forces.
Post by
Morec0
Velen wouldn't fight. He wants to unite the Races for the Naaru's Army of Light.
I'm not sure, I think that he might still hold a grudge for the orc's genocidal rampage.
Post by
HiVolt
Velen wouldn't fight. He wants to unite the Races for the Naaru's Army of Light.
I'm not sure, I think that he might still hold a grudge for the orc's genocidal rampage.
The question is, would he allow that grudge to carry over from the orcs alone to the entirety of the horde. Meaning, if he had the opportunity to lead an army against the Horde(including all Horde races here), would he do it if he only wanted to see the orcs pay for what their elders had done?
Post by
Patty
Velen wouldn't fight. He wants to unite the Races for the Naaru's Army of Light.
I'm not sure, I think that he might still hold a grudge for the orc's genocidal rampage.I don't think he does hold a grudge. After all, Velen was only saved from being a leader of the Burning Legion by the Naaru, the Orcs never had the Naaru. I think he feels remorse and regret for the Orcs, but not hatred.
Post by
HiVolt
Velen wouldn't fight. He wants to unite the Races for the Naaru's Army of Light.
I'm not sure, I think that he might still hold a grudge for the orc's genocidal rampage.I don't think he does hold a grudge. After all, Velen was only saved from being a leader of the Burning Legion by the Naaru, the Orcs never had the Naaru. I think he feels remorse and regret for the Orcs, but not hatred.
Yeah, Velen is kind of the penultimate nice guy.
Post by
taurenmoo812
Velen wouldn't fight. He wants to unite the Races for the Naaru's Army of Light.
I'm not sure, I think that he might still hold a grudge for the orc's genocidal rampage.I don't think he does hold a grudge. After all, Velen was only saved from being a leader of the Burning Legion by the Naaru, the Orcs never had the Naaru. I think he feels remorse and regret for the Orcs, but not hatred.
Yeah, Velen is kind of the penultimate nice guy.
I agree. I read rise of the horde, and saw the kind of person Velen was. He gave a welcome arm to two young orcs in shattrath (durotan and orgrim). When the orcs fell to corruption, Velen tried to find any peaceful resolution he could with them. He was wise enough to see they were corrupted by something rather then just pegging them as savage murderers.
And then, in the recent events, he's the only leader who manages to see the grander scale of things, concerning the legion for one.
When kil'jaeden was defeated and sent back through the sunwell, he appears to both sides, regardless of faction, and shows how he doesn't hold any animosity to even the orcs.
Even if his own people might not see the same way he does, Velen himself is one of the wisest beings on azeroth for a reason.
Post by
184848
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Adamsm
Duh, size. Trolls taller then humans, Orc's taller then dwarves, Night Elf taller then Forsaken, Tauren's equal to 5 gnomes, Draenei taller the BE and Worgen's much taller then the Gobs.
Post by
184848
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
HiVolt
Particularly hard to figure out, but I'll try.
Humans - Trolls: Well, the seat of power within the Alliance in the Eastern Kingdoms before Varian returned was in Ironforge, so this made the Humans sort of a secondary race, which is what Trolls are for the Horde.
Dwarves - Orcs: See the explanation for Humans - Trolls.
Night Elves - Forsaken: The last two to join either faction before World of Warcraft.
Gnomes - Tauren: Gnomes are the right-hand people of the Dwarves, and the with Cairne Bloodhoof being Thrall's right hand man in the Third War, I guess that would apply for the Tauren.
Draenei - Blood Elves: See the explanation for Night Elves - Forsaken, except apply the Burning Crusade
Worgen - Goblins: Again, see above and apply the Cataclysm.
That's my stab at it.
Post by
184848
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
HiVolt
Particularly hard to figure out, but I'll try.
Humans - Trolls: Well, the seat of power within the Alliance in the Eastern Kingdoms before Varian returned was in Ironforge, so this made the Humans sort of a secondary race, which is what Trolls are for the Horde.
Dwarves - Orcs: See the explanation for Humans - Trolls.
Night Elves - Forsaken: The last two to join either faction before World of Warcraft.
Gnomes - Tauren: Gnomes are the right-hand people of the Dwarves, and the with Cairne Bloodhoof being Thrall's right hand man in the Third War, I guess that would apply for the Tauren.
Draenei - Blood Elves: See the explanation for Night Elves - Forsaken, except apply the Burning Crusade
Worgen - Goblins: Again, see above and apply the Cataclysm.
That's my stab at it.
That's a pretty interesting... stab. I gotta say, this really does make sense. It's actually completely unrelated to the Lore though...
With the original races it had to do with the amount of classes that were available to them--- which actually makes Night Elves and Dwarfs, Undead and Orcs interchangeable. Draenei and Blood Elves came together with the same amount of classes, as will Worgen and Goblins. It's an old in-game balance that I think is being abandoned with Cataclysm, and the reason that Dwarfs suddenly lost the ability to become mages when the original game officially came out.
Oh well, it was a guess after all. I just figured it had to be something lore-related, what with this being the L&RP forum.
Post by
Patty
If it was actual war, it could be:
Orcs - Night Elves
Goblins - Gnomes
Dwarves - Trolls
Forsaken - Worgen
Blood Elves - Humans
Tauren - Draenei.
Edit: Reasoning behind it;
Orcs V Night Elves in Ashenvale
Goblins v Gnomes - technology war.
Forsaken v Worgen due to close proximity.
Dwarves and Trolls are like the Right hand of their faction.
Blood Elves have a grudge with Humans, they left them behind and acted like racist bigots.
Tauren and Draenei are the last races left, and at least they could both be roflstomping with Hooves.
Post by
Adamsm
Tauren - Draenei.I'd love to see that war:
Cairne and Velen sitting around a fire. "Pass the peace pipe man." "Sure thing. So, those big glowing crystal things... their from space right?"
Post by
Arkham
Why exactly must the machups be strictly dualistic in nature?
I mean, for example, the humans have an ongoing conflict with the Orcs and the Forsaken. They haven't had any recent big conflicts with the Blood Elves, but they've obviously clashed with them in the past (WC3).
Why insist on only picking one of them as "these guys VS humans" for the sake of having "matchups?"
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