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Demonic Pact help please and thank you.
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Post by
343393
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Post by
424328
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Post by
MegaVolt
The raids best geared Warlock should go demo. Fully raid buffed he can have as much as 4k spellpower, meaning a 400 spellpower buff to the whole raid. That is totally awesome, well worth the individual dps loss for that Warlock and waaaay better then the Shaman totem.
By the way I was told that it still makes sense to have the Shaman around. His totem will buff the initial Warlock SP so that Demonic Pact then gives a bigger bonus to the raid (28 more then). Is that true?
Post by
343393
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Post by
343393
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Post by
424328
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Post by
343393
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Post by
MegaVolt
On the keeping the totem, depends. Compare his best DPS replacement totem with the DPS increase of 28 SP for every caster.
Well the question is if it works at all. Does the Totem of Wrath buff really make Demonic Pact stronger. The effects on their own of course don't stack but will Demonic Pact proc off the 280 more spellpower that the Warlock initially has from Totem of Wrath? How about when Demonic Pact is refreshed ... what SP will be used to calculate the 10% then?
Example:
Warlock has 3000 spellpower.
DP will give a 300 spellpower buff.
Warlock now has 3300 spellpower.
DP refresh will still only give a 300 spellpower buff.
DP is removed. Shaman drops ToW.
Warlock now has 3280 spellpower.
DP procs. Will it proc for 10% of his current SP (328)? Or will it proc for 10% of his base SP (300)? Will it be 3328 spellpower (compared to the 3280 from ToW alone and the 3300 from DP proc without ToW being up at that time) now?
One more thing: I was told that DP will not have a 100% uptime. ToW on the other hand has a guranteed 100% uptime. So having both still might be very useful, no matter if ToW really boosts DP.
Post by
343393
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Post by
asakawa
totem of wrath
will
buff the first DP effect but DP does not buff itself, so when the first DP is refreshed by the pet's next crit the warlock will have the DP buff, which will have over-written the ToW buff, meaning that subsequent DPs will be lower than the first.
the way to get around this is to use a macro that cancels the DP buff from yourself, allowing teh toW buff to reapply. this is a further loss to personal DPS to provide a higher gain in rDPS. it was a clear win when warlocks were first breaking the 2800 SP needed to beat ToW but now we comfortably sit at 4k you need to have a lot of casters to make the benefit worth it. this will never happen in a 10 man team and is pretty unlikely even in a 25man.
if you don't have a Ele, shaman then the rDPS far outweighs the personal DPS loss. with an ele shaman it's still worth it if you have around 4k SP with raid buffs, below that it's debatable but (i'd say) probable.
edit: btw, the macro goes
/cancel aura demonic pact
/cast shadow bolt
-you put it on a spam spell
Post by
MegaVolt
The pet dying should not really be a problem. However, the pet might not always be able to attack.
Let's look at Icehowl for example: Assume the pet gets frozen, then the wall knockback happens. In that time the DP buff will surely drop since the pet is not attacking for quite a while. Then after he hits the wall you want to full out nuke him as hard as possible. But you will not have DP up then, at least not until the first pet crit. So if you are a bit unlucky there you might have the whole stun phase without DP active. A backup ToW might make a lot of sense there.
On the other hand if the backup ToW is not needed the Shamans can greatly increase their personal dps by dropping a Magma Totem or a Searing Totem. With high spellpower those two hit pretty hard, easily bossing the elemental Shamans dps by 5%.
Thanks asakawa. So basically (unless the Warlock does cancel his buff all the time) having the Shaman around is useless if the Warlock manages to have 100% uptime on DP, did I get that right? So if the Warlock goes demo the (usually low dps) elemental Shamans can be replaced by higher dps classes/specs (like enhancement Shamans ;)).
Sevencrosses: You should go and tell your Shamans that. Look how happy they are that they suggested going demo to you :D
Oh about the cancelaura thingy:
I don't think it's worth it. The cost is even higher then you described. The Warlock will have to cancel DP on himself all the time which is a loss of about 100 personal SP. On top of that there always has to be a backup ToW. The raid benefit of having 28 more SP on every caster should clearly be superior to having 100 more SP on the Warlock (at least in 25man) but the Shaman will also lose a lot of dps by keeping the redundant ToW active which is a
huge
damage loss compared to having e.g. Searing Totem.
Post by
asakawa
the same goes for the CoE debuff. we can put up a nice long lasting debuff but druids and DKs need to attack at least every 12-21 seconds. as you say these periods of time do happen in regular raids.
edit, that's it yes. uptime during continuous combat will be very high. the times you will see DP uptime drop are exactly the situations you mention. it
can
happen while the FG is able to attack continuously (RNG is random after all) but will be relatively rare.
Post by
343393
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Post by
asakawa
demo uses CoA to proc MC. this is relatively important.
destro locks use CoD because it's a good use of a GCD. this is relatively unimportant.
if several warlocks of different specs are in a raid the destro lock should always apply CoE.
the CoE flow chart - best to worst:
unholyDK > boomkin > destro > Affliction > demo.
Post by
abulurd
meta is worth a lot more than devestation, iirc the raid buff demo spec is
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#IZouchkAkibsguAoE00V:qTo
or something along those lines.
Post by
310922
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Post by
HxCory
IMO Demo Locks should put up the CoE, we're already sacrificing our personal DPS in favor of RDPS. The Destro locks will get a good bit of DPS from CoD as well as Aff locks getting a bunch of CoA.
I agree with Waka, I enjoy being Demo, it's a fun spec with a fun Rotation, as well as a cool talent, Meta.
Post by
asakawa
well, i was pretty confident that MC uptime lost would severely hinder demo's performance but, sunning a simcraft we have:destro
9746 with curse
9545 without curse
=201 loss
demo
9343 with
9141 without
=202 loss
incredibly close.
i still think that destro gains relatively little from damage curses except a slightly higher DPET spell to cast once a minute while demo has synergy but the numbers show that you can play it how you like in your raid without messing things up.
edit: affliction, for the sake of completeness:9086 with
8732 without
=354 loss
(all done with 3.2.2 mechanics and T9 BiS
Post by
Kerminator
I play demo for our raids.
When the boss is under 35% and you're using Soul Fire while decimation is up. Stand at or around 30 yards. I'm able to alternate Shadowbolt and Soul Fire, one right after another and Decimation is up and consumed by every soul fire without trying to cast it without it up and molten core is usually up as well.
Unfortunately if the boss gets moved to close to you, it screws up rotation as decimation wont be back up by the time you cast soulfire again.
Post by
asakawa
we call that soul fire weaving. i can't see what that was in relation to.
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