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Arcane Subtlety and Spell Penetration
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Post by
DrakeLord
Well first off, I wanna say I'm a complete NOOB when it comes to caster classes. My main's a Feral Druid so I've had a bit of touch with some spells, but not as much as I'd like.
So I have a new mage, which I'm leveling Frost, ATM. As soon as I hit 29 I'm gonna go and do a bit of BGs just for fun. Now I've been looking at the rewards for WSG and AB, and I came across Rune of Perfection. Now, is Spell Penetration simply mean it ignores a certain number of resist points an opponent has? Like the first Rune. It has 10 Spell Pen. Would this ignore a Tauren's Nature resist? Or a Dwarf's Frost resist? (If they had no extra resist besides they're original racial)
And does Arcane Subtlety work the same way?
Also, do mobs use this form of resistance too? So that both the Rune and Arcane Subtletly reduce the chance for a mob to resist?
Post by
82484
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Skyfire
The level based resist kind: that talent you have in your frost tree, Elemental Precision and Arcane Focus in arcane tree reduce these kind of resists. You're fighting a mob 4 levels higher than you and you just can't seem to land a spell and all you see is Resist, Resist, Resist. Arcane Subtlety and Rune of Perfection
do
improve these kinds of resists.
Corrected? :)
Also, you won't notice any partial resists when using Frostbolt because it is a binary spell. What this means is that either your frost bolts will hit the target for damage (after any frost resistance it may have) or it will not hit at all. Combat that by raising your spell hit percentage with either Spell Hit Rating on gear or the talent in frost Elemental Precision.
Incorrect, to a degree. All spells will benefit from Spell Pen as well as Spell Hit. What makes it "binary" is that it either hits, or misses. Say an opponent has 350 resistance. The most likely outcome for a non-binary spell (eg, Fireball) is a 75% resist, followed by 50% and 100% in equal numbers, because 350 resistance, over a sustained period of time, will provide a 75% damage reduction from incoming spells. Note that this is a 75% decrease
over time
, which is what is most important.
Now take that same character, and fire a Frostbolt at him. Now, it's going to either be a hit, or a miss, correct? Well, that same 75% over time applies here also. So, 75% of the time, your Frostbolt will do 0 damage. The other 25% of the time, it will do full damage. Thus, on average, Frostbolt will do just as much damage as Fireball in this sense... theoretically. Unfortunately for Frostbolt, the spell checks twice to see if it landed: the first time to land the spell, and second time to land the chill. If either are resisted, than the Frostbolt will pop a "Resist" for you.
and finally, I feel the Rune of Perfection will not do you much good. There are few mobs I can think of with very high frost resistance so save the honor and marks for something else.
Agreed. Few even at level 70 use it, where it would be of the most use. Spell Penetration, while useful in a minor amount, isn't worth the loss of a trinket slot.
Post by
17654
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Post by
DrakeLord
Ok. I think I get it now. So if I wanted to stay at the 29 bracket a while to have PvP fun (not necissarily a twink, though), Arcane Subtlety and the Rune would help in the BG, since they're my level, but once I decide to move on and start leveling again, they won't be as much help? That is, if I'm fighting mobs higher level than me.
Also, as another question, should I pick up two points in Arcane for AS for the BG? And get the Rune simply for killing twinks easier? I intend to do a
lot
before I go to 30. Maybe get up to 100+ honor marks or something. Maybe more.
Then once I get to 30, respec out of AS and get Ice Block?
Post by
Skyfire
Let's see a proposed build. I would personally suggest ignoring Arcane completely for the purposes of PvPing, even going so far as to put all 20 points into Frost, since that seems to be where you want to go anyway.
Post by
DrakeLord
This
would be my build with two points in AS, and
this
would be my build without it.
And in case you want it, I'm aiming for
this
build at 70, if and when I get there. ;P
Post by
Skyfire
I'd switch up your at 70 build to
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=oZZiArIRfxsiqt
, since AS isn't any good if you aren't going to be casting Arcane spells... which you won't be as a Frost mage. :P
And
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=oZZViM0o0x
should be your build at 29. Crits + Shatter = fun fun fun
Post by
94669
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
DrakeLord
I'd switch up your at 70 build to
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=oZZiArIRfxsiqt
, since AS isn't any good if you aren't going to be casting Arcane spells... which you won't be as a Frost mage. :P
And
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=oZZViM0o0x
should be your build at 29. Crits + Shatter = fun fun fun
Ah. That would work so much better. I had it stuck in my head that Permafrost would be absolutely needed to make WSG flag runners mad, but that crit sounds way more fun. Thanks. :)
And those builds help a lot, luclan. Master of Elements and Playing with Fire will probaly help a bit for a bit more damage and a bit more mana.
Also, when I first made my full Frost build, I honestly had AoE farming stuck in my head (hence the CoC improvement and only 2 in Imp Blizz), but now that I'm talking to good mages, is AoE farming good for grinding at all? Or should I just stick with instances?
Or should I AoE grind in instances? Heh. :P
Post by
94669
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
DrakeLord
Ok. Cool. I'll keep that in mind.
Thanks guys! I know what I want to do now. And I'll skip the AoE grinding for now.
Lvl 29 and PvP here I come. :)
Post by
96710
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