Blood/Frost PvP hybrid for review

Post by tao3927

I'm offering up a spec I'm considering. It's a bit off the beaten path, but the theories behind the build are sound.

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#jfVMqh0csboZhg0thMhofz:aNZz

That's the root - it goes up to hysteria and hungering cold, maxing obliterate crit along the way, mixed with survival CDs. Explanations for talent choice/focus below.

Blood (31 points)

2/2 Butchery
3/3 Subversion - Ob crit
5/5 Bladed Armor
2/2 Two-Handed Weapon Specialization
1/1 Rune Tap - Survivability
5/5 Dark Conviction - Ob crit
3/3 Death Rune Mastery - Ob given flexibility
3/3 Veteran of the Third War
1/1 Mark of Blood - survivability/rogue CC
3/3 Bloody Vengeance - Ob crit fueled damage boost
2/2 Abomination's Might - Ob triggered AP boost
1/1 Hysteria - Burst

Frost (31 points)

3/3 Improved Icy Touch
5/5 Toughness - Anti-snare (plus helps Bladed Armor ever so slightly)
2/2 Icy Reach
5/5 Icy Talons
1/1 Lichborne - Anti CC / Self DC heals
3/3 Annihilation - Ob crit
2/2 Endless Winter
3/3 Frigid Dreadplate - Anti melee D
1/1 Deathchill - Burst
2/2 Merciless Combat - Kill burst
3/3 Rime - Ob crit
1/1 Hungering Cold - CC

Obliterate glyph for damage. HC glyph for CC. One open for personal flavor. Death's Embrace for more self heals in Lichborne.

There's 9 points left to customize these trees. I like going up to Vampiric Blood for more survivability myself, but others may go to Unbreakable Armor, or Unholy Command.

Thoughts?

The build I'm tending toward:

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#jfVMqI0csbR0oZhg0thMhofu:aNhz0m

Adds Imp Rune Tap, Chillblains, and Imp. Blood Presence with Rune Tap glyph.

Post by 334662

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Post by tao3927

Been considering something along the lines of a variant of that myself but Icy Talons is wasted. the issue is the damage on Icy Touch has been so severely nerfed not sure if I want to run it. Running a Blood with 20pts into Frost at the moment using DS and enjoying it but not really all that great in Arenas at the moment :P

You NEED Chillblains though, you have no snares other then Chains of Ice (which is dispellable) therefore you need something like Chillblains, Desecration or Heart Strike (glyphed) or you're screwed in PvP :(

I went into Icy Talons because it's the best use of talent points considering that I'm not getting HB, or FS. I suppose I could get RPM, but that would just buffer any overflow RP rather than bringing actual use to the build (not like I'm building up RP for DRW burst), plus I'm not sure I'd get as much use out of any other talent building up to that point than Icy Talons (as they mostly build upon HB or FS). Black Ice doesn't help out a lot either, seeing that most of the damage in this build is physical.

Actually, the Chillblains is the CC in this build, not the CoI. Check out this post at EJ:

http://elitistjerks.com/f38/t37419-deathknight_pvp_thread/p19/#post1212830

Yes, this build needs some sort of undispellable snare, and icy touch w/ chillblains does the trick. The Endless Winter is chosen mainly for the free interrupt, not for FF w/ CoI. Chillblains can be spread with pestilence should others get in range, and it's icing on the cake with HC.

I do suppose that should become a part of the base build. I didn't think of it save for my personal variant. Base should now be:

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#jfVMqh0csboZhg0thMhofu:aNZz

However, should one want Unholy Command, you'll need to dip a point out elsewhere, likely from Chillblains.

Post by 334662

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Post by tao3927

Chains of Ice + Endless Winter + Chillblains.

I completely disagree with Ej's as to the point that any decent PvP'er will ditch the Chains of Ice and you're screwed. My post was before the edit'd relink :P

The thing is, chillblains doesn't apply when you hit someone with CoI because CoI overwrites Chillblains. That's why I quoted the EJ post. I hope it's a bug, and that the way these snares interact is reviewed.

Personally for a filler I would have ran KM as it is weak but at least forces instant crits which helps out using IT.

So when KM procs (off of a melee hit, meaning you're in melee range) are you going to hit with a IT instead of saving that F for an Ob? That's going against the build (Ob crit/burst). If you aren't in melee range, you're using the F for IT, but not getting the KM, wasting talent points.

If you're really not using Chains of Ice, there's an issue. It's hands down one of the best PvP abilities with Endless Winter. It removes the requirement of IT, arrests movement and with PvP gloves (which you should get despite any naysayers) can give you a free Frost Rune for an IT after Chains of Ice or refresh on CoI.

It's handy - trading the damage of IT for a root/snare +FF, but, as you noted, a dispellable snare. The gloves ability to spam is nice. Without chillblains though, spammed dispels have them free in 4.5 seconds (2 F + gloves) and you're back at square one till those F are ready. Admittedly, this is just arguing against a matchup with dispelling classes, and those 4.5 seconds can get a healer a bit away.

This has kept my healer alive in a lot of situations, the only time I really have any issue with CoI being weak is vs Pally or vs Warrior. (intercept will still launch them at target despite CoI).

Freedom is a pain but does not remove Frost Fever that CoI inflicts anyway. All in all there's no reason as Frost (or Frost variant in PvP) to not use CoI as it's really the only spell that's completely reliable. (Chillblains of course is amazing with Endless Winter and makes Frost so strong in it as it's the only ranged slow DK's have which helps prevent kiting)

Yes, the real problem is how Chillblains and CoI work together. The biggest downer being that while CoI is up, chillblains cannot be.

I like the revamped spec btw, a couple points different from what I was planning on trying out. So tell me how it goes, I'm quite interested, especially vs Prot or Holy Pally and Arms/Fury Warriors.

Heh, oddly I grew to not like the whole Frost CoI/Chillblains snare situation for my own build. CoI + gloves is great, and Chillblains is great, and they need to work together, but don't. I venture this is one of Frost's largest hurdles for PvP. I actually doubt I'll run this myself, but I, too, would like to hear anyone results with it. :)

Keep in mind that this build would have to gear for APr, given the nature of it's damage. With that gear vs your pally/warrior matchup, I think it would have a slight edge.

Post by 334662

This post was from a user who has deleted their account.

Blood/Frost PvP hybrid for review

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