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New Warchief?
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Post by
Adamsm
You keep thinking like that....since the only thing there that is true is they aren't shamanstic...well, except for those Blood Elf druids.
Post by
Lordplatypus
their A: Mages not warriors
B: Physically on the lore end of azerothian races.
C: Have a proud history of treachery
D: Druids aren't shamans, it's two religons. so yeah.
Post by
Adamsm
A) All those Spellbreakers, Warriors, Paladins and other melee heavy members of the Blood Elf nation would put that idea to shame.
B) Really? Cause
Lor'themar
,
physical appearance
,
Halduron
and even the
mages
say otherwise. Sure they aren't muscle heads like the Humans, but they aren't china dolls either.
C) No, they have a proud history of deciding to not let the other races send them in to suicides.
D) Still Nature related, which is a portion of Shamanism.
Post by
morginar
their A: Mages not warriors
As of patch 4.0 something blood elven warriors are playable and they have been displayed in lore and game earlier, not all blood knight was originaly priests and spell-brakers are warriors etc.
B: Physically on the lore end of azerothian races.
I think Cell said something like this: That bulky form makes you so slow you can't hit me. what good does that power if you can't land a single blow?
True warriors don't need steriods...
C: Have a proud history of treachery
traitor elves? old argument try to call them the betrayed elves who are pissed.
D: Druids aren't shamans, it's two religons. so yeah.
those have litle in comon beond their nature magic yes?
and
here
we have blood elves using nature magic.
The tauren druids go high in rank (runetotem) and trolls rever the loa. (their gods)
Wonder if we get to see blood elven druids?
Post by
Skreeran
A:
No
,
no
,
no
, and
no
.
B: Lower?
When has that stopped anyone?
C: Like what? They were loyal to Lothar, loyal to the Horde, loyal to the Kirin Tor (until Jaina decided she needed a scapegoat to vent her anger on), and so on. Lady Liadrin gave up on the old ways of draining Naaru and submitted herself to A'dal's service, they allowed the High Elves to take pilgrimage to the Sunwell, and gave their lives in the Shattered Sun Offensive and in service to the Argent Crusade. They have their missteps in their history, but overall they've been pretty morally upright.
I don't think it's realistic for a Blood Elf to become Warchief, expecially considering how hard Vol'jin is being groomed for the role, but that's because the Horde is too full of prejudiced people. It'd be like a Buddhist were elected President. Sure, there's nothing wrong with it and it has no bearing on how good of a person they are, but it's not going to happen for a long time because people have a predecided idea of what a president should be and Buddhist is too far from that.
Post by
Adamsm
Apparently, because Garithos was off 'saving' elves, and his family died to the Horde, that means that all Elves are traitors...somehow.
Post by
Rankkor
their A: Mages not warriors.
Wrong. Their Farstriders, Blood Knights, and Spell-breakers (read: warriors that specialize in hunting mages down) would like to have a word with you.
B: Physically on the lore end of azerothian races.
So? the horde is not all about brute strenght, the goblins aren't a physically strong race either, they still have their place in the horde just fine, as do the forsakens.
C: Have a proud history of treachery
This again? dude, THEY NEVER BETRAYED ANYONE. The alliance TRIED TO KILL THEM ALL. They decided to not allow themselves to be used.
You have been purposely avoiding to answer my question: Why are you not considering the Gilneans to be traitors? they did used the alliance as a meat-shield to protect their borders, and once they had no more use for them, decided to GTFO, didn't contributed with money to rebuild the damage done by the horde (whereas all of the rest of the alliance INCLUDING THE ELVES, gave a ton of money to aid in the reconstruction, on building Nethergarde Keep to protect the dark portal, and maintain the concentration camps)
As if all of this was not enough (All take, zero giving) they then built a giant wall, and did JACK SQUAT on the third war, while their friends and allies who bled and died TO KEEP THEM SAFE, died by the thousands.
For some reason you don't consider them traitors. Instead you focus all your anger at the elves.
Why is this? are you gonna ignore me again?
D: Druids aren't shamans, it's two religons. so yeah
Again, so? Blood elves are as much into nature as the rest of the horde, their Farstriders are living proof of that. And there aint no rule that a shaman HAS to be the new warchief. After all, 3 out of the 4 warchiefs in the history of the horde have had zero ties to shamanism. (Blackhand, Doomhammer, and Garrosh)
As for their current loyalty, they've been loyal to the horde, Loyal to the Kirin Tor, (no you can't point at Thalen Songweaver as proof that all elves are traitors, after all the humans had Benedictus, the night elves had Fandral, and Maiev, the gnomes had Thermaplug, the gilneans had Godfrey, ect. A single person doesn't dictates the rest of the race) and loyal to their friends.
They're currently conspiring against Garrosh on 5.2, but that's because garrosh treated them like disposable pawns EXACTLY like garithos, to obtain the divine bell, and the blood elves are not the only ones planning to rebel, the trolls are too.
Apparently, because Garithos was off 'saving' elves, and his family died to the Horde, that means that all Elves are traitors...somehow.
I just can't understand his line of reasoning. Its bonkers. How exactly can he call the elves traitors, but be so cool with the gilneans? The elves taught humanity how to wield magic in exchange for help in the troll wars, they kept their end of the bargain, even helped out humanity again when they began having demon problems in dalaran, and the council of tirisfal was established, they helped humanity again on the second war, and while they complained about the damage done to their forest, that's all they did, complain, when push came to shove, they still provided physical and economical backing to the alliance in the aftermatch of the second war AND DURING the third war.
Gilneas did absolutely NONE of the above, they are 100% traitors in every way, and I really don't get why did the alliance just allowed them in with zero repercussions about it whatsoever. I guess desperate times call for desperate means and they feel that the gilneans paid for their transgressions with the whole worgen and forsaken invasions.
I don't think it's realistic for a Blood Elf to become Warchief, expecially considering how hard Vol'jin is being groomed for the role.
I don't see how vol'jin is being groomed up for the role. Sure he got a new model, and some minor action on 5.1, but that's about it. Nothing so far indicates him being the next candidate.
If we get down to it, based on what we've seen in 5.1 and 5.2, Lor'themar has gotten more action than Vol'jin. I will have to recognize one thing: Lor'themar is the first himself to admit that he feels more alive in the battlefield than in a court room, he's more of a fighter than a politico, so I could even see him turning down the mantle of warchief if it was passed to him, and maybe even put someone else as regent lord of silvermoon while he leads the charge in the battlefield for the elven forces.
but that's because the Horde is too full of prejudiced people.
This is true, but strife gets rid of prejudices real quick. Main reason Garrosh got so much support is because people on the horde demanded change, Thrall was too passive, and too willing to look the other way, both for what the alliance did, and for what the horde did, all in an effort to maintain the very fragile and unstable status quo of cold war. This led to stuff like the battle for UC, and other diplomatic problems.
People demand change, and in garrosh they have it. Turns out the change wasn't as pretty as they expected, so once garrosh is down, one would think they'd want someone as diametrically opposed to what he was as possible. This is my main reason to believe its not gonna be an orc.
Post by
Adamsm
Vol'jin is getting the next book remember Rank, which to him, and it is a good guess, is a sign that they are setting Vol'jin up to take the reins.
Myself, I'm seeing Thrall back as the Warchief but that's just me...and you know, there still isn't any sign that the Warchief is being divorced from the position of leadership of the Orcs at the same.
Post by
Skreeran
Vol'jin is getting the next book remember Rank, which to him, and it is a good guess, is a sign that they are setting Vol'jin up to take the reins.This is the biggest reason, I think. The fact that he got a new model, his own scenario in 5.1, and has the biggest part in scheming against Garrosh, I'm putting all my money on him.
Post by
Rankkor
Fair enough. I just think that Lor'themar also has a realistic chance as well.
Also, skree when are you getting back into the game? havent' seen you in ages.
Post by
Skreeran
Fair enough. I just think that Lor'themar also has a realistic chance as well.
Also, skree when are you getting back into the game? havent' seen you in ages.I'm been waiting for 5.2 mainly. Got a little WoW'd out. :\
Post by
Rankkor
Fair enough. I just think that Lor'themar also has a realistic chance as well.
Also, skree when are you getting back into the game? havent' seen you in ages.I'm been waiting for 5.2 mainly. Got a little WoW'd out. :\
ahh well its either gonna be in 2 days, or 2 weeks. So I hope to see you ingame soon. Remember, we have a certain Human Witch and Elven Psycho to put down. ;)
Post by
Adamsm
Three weeks; season ends on the 5th, usually a week after that for all the stuff to be handed out, then the patch.
Post by
Rankkor
Three weeks; season ends on the 5th, usually a week after that for all the stuff to be handed out, then the patch.
CURSE YOU and your premonition powers!
/shake fist angry.
Post by
Adamsm
Lol, this isn't really premonition powers this time; just what the standard patch cycle is.
Post by
Lordplatypus
BURN THE WITCH!.
Anyone got a method for that?
Oh nevermind.
Simply put, most orcs would think that elves are prissy mage female-men. They'd revolt.
Tauren find arcane magic unatural. Revolt
Oh and the biggest problem is how the elves are still under slyvanna's high heel. They can't stop any attack without aid right now. In fact, it's a rather unstable balance of power all around with the alliance more than capable of destroying the EK horde while vice versa is more or less true for the horde in kalimdor. However, overall forces are equal, meaning as long as EK alliance a Kalimdor horde sends people to the other side during attacks, nothing much will happen.
It's an unstable balance of power, but it's a balance.
Post by
Rankkor
Simply put, most orcs would think that elves are prissy mage female-men. They'd revolt.
/rollseyes.
Tauren find arcane magic unatural. Revolt
No they don't. Look at your own night elves for that please.
Oh and the biggest problem is how the elves are still under slyvanna's high heel.
No they're not. This was back in TBC. They now have the sunwell, and quel'thalas is probably the hardest place to invade in all of azeroth due to the raw power of the well empowering their defenses. Please understand that the sunwell is the closest we have to a second well of eternity on this world.
. They can't stop any attack without aid right now.
We've been over this on the alliance vs horde thread, this is not true.
In fact, it's a rather unstable balance of power all around with the alliance more than capable of destroying the EK horde
Right, this is why their invasion of Silverpine went so awesome, why they were able to take back gilneas effortlessly, why the dwarven attack on hillsbrad was a smashing success, why their attack on stonard went off perfectly, and why the battle of andorhal was a shiny alliance victory....................
ohhh wait......... right. All of the above were colossal failures.
while vice versa is more or less true for the horde in kalimdor.
"more or less" my boot, it is true. Look at the MANY horde victories in Kalimdor, including Azshara, Ashenvale (where they were only repelled on 2 fronts, Astranaar, and Maestra's Post) Desolace, Stonetalon, Theramoore, South Barrens, Durotar, ect.
However, overall forces are equal, meaning as long as EK alliance a Kalimdor horde sends people to the other side during attacks, nothing much will happen.
Except none of this is true, there is no such thing as a deterrent in azeroth, just look at the forsaken, they have a plague capable of turning anyone into goo, and valkyrs that can turn your own dead into enemy troops. That SHOULD had been a strong deterrent to prevent any alliance campaign against them, and yet they still push.
Ditto for the horde, considering the massive technological and numerical advantage that the alliance has on them, it SHOULD act as a deterrent against acts of aggression but it doesnt. There is no such thing as a "balance of power", and never has been. Back when Thrall led the horde, we had a passive cold war, and that was the closest we had to a form of balance.
That all died the moment he put the worst person ever in charge of the horde.
It's an unstable balance of power, but it's a balance.
Wrong. I'd bother to explain this ,but across 5 different threads, you've proven to be immune to all attempts of reasoning, you live in your own pretty world up there, so I'm not gonna bother.
Post by
Lordplatypus
We already had elves attempting to guard the well against a superior force (Scourge).
While the infiltrator was there, it would have meant nothing if the well was the godmode you make it out to be.
What stops some gnomes from setting up a Radiation right under the elves nose and turn them into the next irritated wasteland? It's practically a neutron weapon, that's the only effective city-razer left.
Just read the books and comics for the far more numerous times the alliance hands the horde it's rear end and the horde just fails. In-game it's just the simple fact that our chief lore guy, metzen, has a hard-on for orcs and the horde.
The horde was facing a faction that more or less had very few coordinated attacks due to an idiot ball, yet was still barely able to push the front forwards.
Unless you stop loving elves, you're just unreliable peroid.
Tauren's find the taint of magic unbearable already, so your first point is disproven.
Orcs are a warrior culture, if they dislike humans, who are smaller than them, the even smaller and effeminate elves would be taken as badly as ever.
We're not talking about the worldly leaders, we're talking about the common members of the race who act as any simpler civilization.
Post by
Rankkor
We already had elves attempting to guard the well against a superior force (Scourge).
While the infiltrator was there, it would have meant nothing if the well was the godmode you make it out to be.
Here's the funny thing:
The well WAS the godmode I made it out to be. The runestone and sunwell defences were so powerful, the scourge was unable to just bruteforce their way through it, they NEEDED an inside agent to even set foot inside. If they hadn't had that inside agent, their invasion force would had been obliterated.
What stops some gnomes from setting up a Radiation right under the elves nose and turn them into the next irritated wasteland?
Several things. Radiation can't just be created under thin air, if it was, we'd see gnomes using it more often, but no, its only in gnomeregan that they used it. Why? they built REACTORS in there to power up the city, and then they removed the safety overrides to make them go meltdown-mode.
You honest-to-god think they can just build a reactor in the middle of the battlefield and then make it explode without hurting their own troops? come on man, get a grip.
It's practically a neutron weapon, that's the only effective city-razer left.
Nope, that's the blight you're looking for, and who has that? ohhh yeah.
Just read the books and comics for the far more numerous times the alliance hands the horde it's rear end and the horde just fails. In-game it's just the simple fact that our chief lore guy, metzen, has a hard-on for orcs and the horde.
Wrong.
I read the books, First war? horde won, without even trying.
Second War? the horde ALMOST won, the only reason they lost was due to gul'dan taking almost 50% of their forces to go after the tomb of Sargeras.
The very fact that you blame METZEN for any alliance defeat shows how unwilling you are to accept facts and just make stuff up as you go. If Metzen was really that biased, then we wouldn't have any alliance victories at all. And yet, out of all the gunships made in the game, only 1 alliance gunship has crashed, whereas we've had over 8 horde gunships blown to hell (Gilneas, Endtime, Deepholm, Dragon Soul, Jade Forest, Twilight Highlands, ect)
The horde was facing a faction that more or less had very few coordinated attacks due to an idiot ball, yet was still barely able to push the front forwards.
Wrong. The alliance was in fact VERY coordinated in the second war thanks to Lothar, and it took them all they got to even made a dent on the horde forces, it was the orcs who were brutes, with pretty much zero plans of attacks other than zerg rushes, and even then, they came this close to winning that one too.
Tauren's find the taint of magic unbearable already, so your first point is disproven.
Care to back that up? because so far, only night elves have found arcane magic to be an abomination, and to this day they still treat the highborn like crap.
Taurens have no beef (lolpun) against arcane magic, if they did they wouldn't have an entire mage coven in their city.
Orcs are a warrior culture, if they dislike humans, who are smaller than them, the even smaller and effeminate elves would be taken as badly as ever.
And this is yet another part where you're wrong. Orcs are a warrior culture, they respect STRENGTH, above all else, size matters not to an orc, if you are strong, they respect you, REGARDLESS OF RACE, as long as you don't do cowardly dishonorable acts. And contrary to what you wanna make them out to be, Blood Elves are among the most powerful races in the world. Even Lorewalker Cho says so on the Jade Forest if you play a blood elf during
this quest
.
Lor'themar himself is one of the most seasoned warriors of azeroth, the dude fought his way ALONE and INJURED while HAVING LOSS HIS LEFT EYE, in the middle of the scourge invasion, all the way to the sunwell, and not a single undead force was able to stop him.
He was unrelentless in the second war, where his first scene in Tides of Darkness was to show up splattered in the blood and gore of all the orcs and trolls he slain personally, and then in war3, he soloed his way to the sunwell across the middle of a zombie apocalypse, while badly wounded, outnumbered, and with one eye missing.
Unless you stop loving elves, you're just unreliable peroid.
HA! now there's the definition of Irony :P
also its "period"
Post by
Adamsm
if they dislike humans,Orcs hate humans for all the @#$% both races have done to each other; has nothing at all to do with size.
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