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Post by
Rouen
Hi all. I'm leveling a priest for the purposes of doing Holy/Disc dual spec to help out our guild since we are short on healers for our second raiding team. My main is a holy paladin and I'm really interested in trying out a more difficult healing class:
The Benevolent Priest.
Here is a link to my paladin for those who are interested.
Linky
My priest is currently level 19 and my healing experience is limited to piddlefarting around Deadmines and Wailing Caverns. GG
Heal
bring the tank from 50% to full. After going through some of the stickies and the spell listing for priest heals, I'm slightly confused on some points and would like a bit of clarification.
Circle of Healing
: Is this ability used by simply click-targeting a party member and casting or does it enable a targeting circle that you can move in specific locations of your choosing? Reference Blizzard/Flamestrike for the latter.
Lesser Heal/Heal : Are these two spells put on the back burner for end game? If so, do you normally just use Flash Heal and Greater Heal for single target burst healing?
Prayer of Healing
: I'd like to verify that this heal is indeed only limited to your party (5 people). Does this only work on your own party or can it also work on the entire party of the player you are targetting?
Lightwell
: I don't remember seeing this used except by Argent mobs in ToC 5 man. Since that is my personal experience, will I find use in this in endgame content?
Holy Nova
: When is it a good time to use this heal? To be more specific, when is it a good time to use this spell with higher priority over... say Circle of Healing or Prayer of Healing?
Prayer of Mending
: This seems to be a really fun spell. Other then prior to tank pulls, when are good times to use this spell? Will it proc off of DoT effects, like ToC's Twin Val'kyr encounter or Marrorgar's Bonestorm?
Power Word: Shield
: This standpoint is from Holy spec. Since this only hits one target at a time, would it be worth the mana expenditure to use this liberally or would the same mana be better spent tossing out Renews? I'm sure this varies by encounter.
I'm a bit short on time, but I plan to come back to ask other questions. Based from what I see, mana management is a big issue for a healing priest, especially at lower levels. I'm trying to plan a bit before I hit 80 and making 5 man's miserable for pugs, so I can be decent going out of the gates until I get more experience with twitch healing as a priest. Thanks in advance for the help.
Post by
Vaeku
As I'm also a new priest, my questions are the same. And I know how you feel about mana management... I hate going into SFK because of all the dispels. Drains half my mana on one pull.
Although I think I can answer one question... From what I've read, you replace Lesser Heal with Heal once you get it, and then replace Heal with Greater Heal once you get that one. And Flash Heal you use in conjunction with Heal and Greater Heal.
Post by
Lodum
Circle of Healing
: Is this ability used by simply click-targeting a party member and casting or does it enable a targeting circle that you can move in specific locations of your choosing? Reference Blizzard/Flamestrike for the latter.You target a player and it will smart target those around it.
Lesser Heal/Heal : Are these two spells put on the back burner for end game? If so, do you normally just use Flash Heal and Greater Heal for single target burst healing?They don't exist endgame. They don't scale with spell power and have outrageous mana costs to heal maybe 300.
Prayer of Healing
: I'd like to verify that this heal is indeed only limited to your party (5 people). Does this only work on your own party or can it also work on the entire party of the player you are targetting?It works on the party of the player you are targetting.
Lightwell
: I don't remember seeing this used except by Argent mobs in ToC 5 man. Since that is my personal experience, will I find use in this in endgame content?Depends. Most likely not, but some people are smart enough to use it and those who raid with people that do say its pretty awesome.
Holy Nova
: When is it a good time to use this heal? To be more specific, when is it a good time to use this spell with higher priority over... say Circle of Healing or Prayer of Healing?I use it in Heroics when I'm bored. /shrug Its about 1.5k to everyone around me and damages things. Nothing to get too excited about, especially with the cost.
Prayer of Mending
: This seems to be a really fun spell. Other then prior to tank pulls, when are good times to use this spell? Will it proc off of DoT effects, like ToC's Twin Val'kyr encounter or Marrorgar's Bonestorm?Yes. It procs off of any damage. And yes, its fun :D
Power Word: Shield
: This standpoint is from Holy spec. Since this only hits one target at a time, would it be worth the mana expenditure to use this liberally or would the same mana be better spent tossing out Renews? I'm sure this varies by encounter. I'm not holy, so I couldn't tell you. But if a Disc priest is in the raid and you use it, you'll probably make them angry.
I'm a bit short on time, but I plan to come back to ask other questions. Based from what I see, mana management is a big issue for a healing priest, especially at lower levels. I'm trying to plan a bit before I hit 80 and making 5 man's miserable for pugs, so I can be decent going out of the gates until I get more experience with twitch healing as a priest. Thanks in advance for the help.Not a problem.
Post by
OscarDivine
Circle of Healing
: Is this ability used by simply click-targeting a party member and casting or does it enable a targeting circle that you can move in specific locations of your choosing? Reference Blizzard/Flamestrike for the latter. point and click. It heals the player and those around him/her.
Lesser Heal/Heal : Are these two spells put on the back burner for end game? If so, do you normally just use Flash Heal and Greater Heal for single target burst healing? You won't use these at all later. Flash and Greater are what is used, though Greater not as much for either spec as it used to be.
Prayer of Healing
: I'd like to verify that this heal is indeed only limited to your party (5 people). Does this only work on your own party or can it also work on the entire party of the player you are targetting? It IS limited to party, and it can be targetted to other raid parties. This is why it is important that the raid leader get smart and actually group the melee together.
Lightwell
: I don't remember seeing this used except by Argent mobs in ToC 5 man. Since that is my personal experience, will I find use in this in endgame content? It has lovely uses, but poor implementation. Few players spec for it because few players know how to use it properly. The usage of this spell depends heavily on DPS/Tanks to click on the well, which means that when they click, they also target. This is a problem, and has been well documented and not at all even hinted at being fixed.
Holy Nova
: When is it a good time to use this heal? To be more specific, when is it a good time to use this spell with higher priority over... say Circle of Healing or Prayer of Healing? This is a good spell to use in a 5 man Heroic instance and sometimes in a 10-man raid, but otherwise, it has few uses in the raid setting. It is limited specifically to your party.
Prayer of Mending
: This seems to be a really fun spell. Other then prior to tank pulls, when are good times to use this spell? Will it proc off of DoT effects, like ToC's Twin Val'kyr encounter or Marrorgar's Bonestorm? Absolutely. It is ALSO a smart-heal, so for a fight like Kologarn, the players who get gripped will ding the PoM around and almost top them all off. One Shaman Chain Heal or a CoH, and the job is done. More applicable uses for us now would include fights like Festergut or Marrowgar.
Power Word: Shield
: This standpoint is from Holy spec. Since this only hits one target at a time, would it be worth the mana expenditure to use this liberally or would the same mana be better spent tossing out Renews? I'm sure this varies by encounter. It should not be used much at all as Holy Spec, but it can be used, depending on play-style. Important to note is that it should NOT be used in the presence of a Disco priest, especially if they are raid-bubble spamming.
I'm a bit short on time, but I plan to come back to ask other questions. Based from what I see, mana management is a big issue for a healing priest, especially at lower levels. I'm trying to plan a bit before I hit 80 and making 5 man's miserable for pugs, so I can be decent going out of the gates until I get more experience with twitch healing as a priest. Thanks in advance for the help.
Yes, mana
mana
gement is very different for Holy priests than it is for Holy Paladins. You have to actively watch your mana reserves as well as your consumption to make sure that you're handling things alright. Gearing properly and becoming familiar with your casts during fights will allow you to instinctively know when you need to pop a Hymn of Hope, shadowfiend, or mana pot. You can easily get two uses of HoH and shadowfiend in each fight if you need to.
Hope some of this helped. Please come again if you have questions. :-)
Post by
Rouen
Thanks Oscar and Lodum for the tips.
Oscar, your comment about Lightwell got me thinking...
It has lovely uses, but poor implementation. Few players spec for it because few players know how to use it properly. The usage of this spell depends heavily on DPS/Tanks to click on the well, which means that when they click, they also target. This is a problem, and has been well documented and not at all even hinted at being fixed.
The issue you described is most definitely a problem, but I have a few ideas of where it could be used with relative safety.
Marrowgar's Bonestorm, Twin Val'kyr during Vortex
(maybe next to a portal so it can be clicked) since people are moving to switch anyway and not healing, it could help give you a boost until the healers are stationary again,
Anuba'rak's burrow phase
when people are running around like chickens with their heads cut off,
Malygos after vortex, Sartharion after a lava wave
, etc
The general theme is when you are in a mobile phase where DPS isn't occurring or must escape from something. Thoughts, suggestions or corrections on this?
I'm also trying to level my priest through the
Energizer Smite Spec
. I must say that this idea is pretty pro. I rarely drop below 90% when chain pulling single mobs. I usually have to drink if I pull around five at once however.
Next, what are the stat weights for Holy and Disc? I saw the Disc weights in a sticky but they seemed out of date. There was no Holy stat weights in the sticky.
Post by
OscarDivine
The issue you described is most definitely a problem, but I have a few ideas of where it could be used with relative safety.
Marrowgar's Bonestorm, Twin Val'kyr during Vortex
(maybe next to a portal so it can be clicked) since people are moving to switch anyway and not healing, it could help give you a boost until the healers are stationary again,
Anuba'rak's burrow phase
when people are running around like chickens with their heads cut off,
Malygos after vortex, Sartharion after a lava wave
, etc
The general theme is when you are in a mobile phase where DPS isn't occurring or must escape from something. Thoughts, suggestions or corrections on this?
Oh absolutely, those are excellent times to use it. But again, it depends on your DPS using it properly. If you have DPS that will click on it, then you have my blessings, go nuts and use it. 9/10 out of ten, it isn't the spell that is problematic, it's the DPS. I used to spec for it so that I could keep myself alive during those phases, but that was only back in the day for Malygos.
There was no Holy stat weights in the sticky.
SP first, Haste second, Crit third.
Get regen until it no longer becomes effective (you can do an intense boss fight without OOMing). and... That's it!
Post by
Rouen
SP first, Haste second, Crit third.
This sounds like what I'm reading for Disc stat weights, since spirit doesn't scale well for Disc priests. Double checking?
Get regen until it no longer becomes effective (you can do an intense boss fight without OOMing). and... That's it!
Ugh... just like my holy paladin. How much haste, spirit, and spellpower is good for ToC 10 level raiding? I don't see jack for crit on what few holy priests I have looked at. I'm not sure if shooting for a lot of spirit for holy will be worth it or not.
Post by
300899
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rouen
Also procs trinkets such as althor abascus and divine aegis, so on and so forth.
Speaking of trinkets, what kind of trinkets should I be looking for?
Right off the bat as a fresh 80, I'll have near immediate access (or the ability to obtain within a reasonable time frame) to the following trinkets. (Not all inclusive)
Talisman of Resurgence
Binding Light
Nevermelting Ice Crystal
Ephemeral Snowflake
Spark of Hope
(Not really viable since the lack of Ulduar raids, but would like to know how this trinket fares against the others)
Tears of the Vanquished
Purified Lunar Dust
(Should be getting fixed in the patch today with +22 SP)
Sliver of Pure Ice
Post by
300899
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rouen
Spark of hope as holy is super fantastic from what i hear, and is worth the time and trouble of going back into ulduar.
I'll have to take that into consideration, thanks!
As for
Althor's Abacus
... maybe I'm just ignorant, but that proc isn't something I'm really excited about. However,
this comment
on the item made me reconsider. Perhaps this is something to shoot for after I'm in healthy ICC-able raiding gear.
try to grab some toc 25 to get the solace **** that. I only say that for one reason. I've tried so hard to get that for my holy paladin since dual solace is BiS. I've come to understand that I'll never obtain the damn thing, so I ended up picking up the subpar Purified Lunar Dust (subpar for mana regen). However... my priest will probably be running ToC 25 again, so maybe I'll get lucky. I hope.
Talisman was awesome for a long time, it was just sooo hard to get away from using, i got so used to all that int, that i felt a little naked when i stopped using and my mana pool took such a huge hit.
That's how I feel on my paladin. Talisman will most likely be my first purchase once I hit 80.
Healing 5 man Heroics
I'm going to ask for some help in a better understanding of what I will be doing in heroics while I gear. I'll come back and ask for some more specifics of raid/tank healing when the time gets closer.
As Holy... will I be taking the time to bubble the entire group or just the tank? Will I be keeping up Renew on the tank at all times? Will Circle of Healing be my primary group heal? I'll assume that Flash Heal will be my group/tank spot healing spell. When is it safe to use Greater Heal, given the long cast time? Any other thoughts?
As Disc... will I be taking the time to bubble the entire group or just the tank? Will I be keeping up Renew on the tank at all times? Will I just be using Flash Heal for party healing and saving Penance for the tanks? Anything other thoughts?
Side Note: Please treat me like a complete scrub when it comes to priest healing, it'll only benefit me in the long run. I won't feel offended.
Post by
300899
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
karlusdavius
Next, what are the stat weights for Holy and Disc? I saw the Disc weights in a sticky but they seemed out of date. There was no Holy stat weights in the sticky.
I really should get round to that. I have no idea how to do it, but i really should get round to that...
Post by
OscarDivine
of course its random so sometimes good sometimes bad, but its a free healing proc that usually accounts for 4-6% of my healing.
I was under the impression that this was a "smart heal"
Post by
Rouen
That's what I hear, but there are some conflicting comments on the item if you look at it in the WoWHead database. Some of the comments state 60%+ of overheal while some state it was very low overheal.
Post by
300899
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rouen
In ToC 10/Triumph badge gear, what are the gemming priorities for both holy and disc? Maybe this will gain me an answer more quickly then asking for the stat weights for both specs.
I went ahead and created a pilot priest (insert lawl) profile using only 232 level gear avaiable from badges and the new 5 man instances. Her professions are Herbalism and Alchemy.
Here is the
linky to the test holy priest.
I intend to make a test Discipline priest when I get some more time and will ask similar questions.
The talent tree will probably be incorrect. I'm looking at the the "Typically All Around" spec listed in the
beginner's guide
and I'm wondering why
Improved Healing
seems to be missing from several of the builds listed. 15% mana cost reduction is significant, right? The glyphs of I chose were guesswork, don't judge them. I'll investigate better options later on.
Side Notes
For the trinkets, I figured Talisman and Tears were the best options early on. Suggestions are welcome.
For the boots, the Prelate's Snowshoes seemed to be the
only
option early on.
For the belt, I wasn't sure whether or not to get
Braid of Salt and Fire
or
Strip of Remorse
because I don't know whether spirit or crit should have the higher priority at this point. I choose Braid for the spirit.
For the back, only the Onyxia 10 cloak was a relatively easy 232 to get.
For all Tier based slots, I went ahead and made the easy decision and went full Tier 9. Suggestions are welcome.
I did not gem anything
because I don't have a grasp on what types of gems should go in what slots, what socket bonuses are worth getting, and which stats are important to boost early on.
Post by
Rouen
Bump.
Maybe clarifying my concerns a little better would help. OP Fail, eh?
Please review the gear/enchants on this
test holy priest
. It is not gemmed because...
A
) I do not know what kinds of socket bonuses to shoot for aka 8 Spirit vs 5 Spellpower
B
) Stat priorities: What is a good number to shoot for haste, spirit, spellpower, intellect and crit %? Will I need a minimum of 400 haste (for example)?
C
) Other then what gear I have on the toon, does anyone have better suggestions on what to equip instead at this point?
D
) Why is the cookie cutter spec... the cookie cutter spec? As mentioned in the previous post, Improved Healing (15% Mana Discount on Greater Heal/Divine Hymn/etc) wasn't taken. I assumed since regen is somewhat stacked that the talent would be taken.
Post by
OscarDivine
well, firstly, bumping your own thread is against the rules. I found that out the hard way one day...
Secondly, for HOLY PRIEST ignore socket bonuses unless it's 9SP or higher, and even then, ignore most of those
Thirdly, If you're going to gem, gem straight spellpower/haste gems (Reckless Ametrine) UNLESS you are already over 20% haste (<-- That is your first haste goal), or if you're lacking in the Regen Department, in which case you should gem for SP/Int gems (Luminous Ametrine) to compensate (ONLY IF NECESSARY!). If you're fine on your Regen and are easily breaking 20% haste unbuffed, then gem STRAIGHT spellpower (runed cardinal rubies). Ignore all socket bonuses and use blue gems only to maintain your Meta gem activity, which should be Insightful Earthsiege.
Gemming for Disco, you should pretty much just gem straight SP unless you're lacking regen, then gem SP/Int. Don't gem for Haste as Disco if you can help it. SP is really your first priority after you get your regen in line. Maintain your meta with SP/MP5 (Royal Dreadstone) gems or Int/MP5 (Dazzling Eye of Zul) gems if you must.
That's pretty much it in a nutshell for Holy...
Extremely rough values you might want to set as an
initial
"goal":
Holy you should shoot for : 25% crit and 20% haste, highest SP you can get
Disco: break 35% crit 15% Haste, Highest SP you can get.
Read the Stickies for Cookie Cutter Specs.
Post by
Aldones
Holy Nova
: When is it a good time to use this heal? To be more specific, when is it a good time to use this spell with higher priority over... say Circle of Healing or Prayer of Healing?I use it in Heroics when I'm bored. /shrug Its about 1.5k to everyone around me and damages things. Nothing to get too excited about, especially with the cost.
Please, I use this spell all the time in heroics...and it's not uncommon for me to out-dps a dps or tank....kind of sad really. Depending on the heroic (and how healing intensive my fail group is) I usually pull 1.5k - 2.5k dps. If I don't pull at least 2k I consider it a fail group. :)
Really though, don't try this until you completely out gear heroic-quality dungeons (that includes leveling). Holy Nova is a terrible spell that has a very low hpm (healing per mana) and the dps output is pathetic for it's dpm (damage per mana)
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