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A glyph to fix Moonkin DPS scaling
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Post by
Ginji
Does anyone like the sound of this suggestion?
Glyph of boosted Wrath
Increases cast time and damage of Wrath by 30%
This should not really change the DPS of the spell but will allow Moonkin to stack more then 400 haste, and will therefore, Moonkin DPS will scale a LOT better with higher end gear.
It will also allow Moonkin the full benefit Wrath Eclipse during Heroism.
Post by
340332
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Ginji
Moonkins will be receiving a 3% damage buff via Earth & Moon.
I know, but that does not fix Moonkin DPS/Gear scaling.
Since Moonkin have a soft cap of 401 haste (the point where Wrath becomes a 1sec cast with a NG proc) Moonkin then lose out bigtime on the value of Haste (where other classes do not), and subsequently, also lose out on their overall value of Crit (because you are not getting full value of the NG proc when casting Wrath).
Additionally, when a Shaman casts Heroism, Moonkin miss out on this buff significantly, as at 401 haste, NG and Heroism, Wrath becomes around a .8 second cast, but is then gimped becasue of the 1 sec GCD.
A Moonkin can just cast Starfire when Heroism is up, but you are then missing out on the Wrath eclipse bonus.
A glyph to increase the cast time and damage of Wrath (but maintaining its current DPS value) will help greatly by raising our haste softcap by a significant margin, and will therefore, help with our gear scaling at high levels.
Post by
340332
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Post by
Mike
I think I read somewhere that NG is in for a nerf as it is pretty op.
no way D:! wtb source!
Post by
Sgtpain
NG was already nerfed. Are you talking about yet another?
Post by
340332
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Ginji
I think I read somewhere that NG is in for a nerf as it is pretty op.
If your issue is that Moonkins don't use haste enough, I'd suggest re-rolling a Shaman.
Moonkins are fairly well ballanced in that we can make use of both haste and crit, and still benefit from them past the soft caps. It's naive to say that haste is useless past the cap because it simply isn't. Half of your rotation still benefits greatly from it. Same goes for crit; SF may have a 100% chance under eclipse, but Wrath won't. This is why we stack haste and crit, not just haste like a Shaman does. Equal amounts of either haste or crit are worth more than Spirit too, even after the caps.
I can understand where you're coming from, but with Cataclysm on the horizon there wouldn't be any point in introducing such a glyph as the whole make up of gear and talents is going to be changing anyway. Besides, which would you take out to put a new one in?
If a change was made to Wrath, Moonkins would become too powerful in comparison to other classes. Especially if you could still get it down to a 1sec cast.
Perhaps if Boomkin were at the top of the DPS tree, NG may be looked at, but since moonkin and Ele Shaman are at the bottom I doubt they would be nerfing it.
You are correct that Moonkin still benefit from haste after the softcap is reached, however its value drops significantly after this point, whereas the other major caster classes (Mage/Warlock) are not affected in this way. So they scale so much better then the Moonkin after around T8 level gear.
For instance, warlocks can have 600 odd haste before incinerate with heroism/bloodlust becomes a 1 sec cast, for Moonkin, 401 Haste with a NG proc already takes you to the 1 sec cast, If Heroism/bloodlust is up at the same time, Wrath becomes about a .8 sec cast but still has the 1 sec GCD... Thats a big chunk of wasted haste/heroism, thats potentially worth 1 extra wrath cast per 5 seconds of heroism
Eliminating this issue with a simple Glyph to add cast time/damage to Wrath would easily fix Moonkin gear/DPS scaling.
Blizzard know there are issues with Balance Druids, thats why they are buffing Earth and Moon to give an extra 6% damage instead of the old 3%, but this does not fix our scaling issues
Post by
Celdhyrean
I'm not entirely sure where I read it. Got a feeling it could have been on an EJ thread someone linked here... theres a good chance it could have been before the last nerf in which case my comment can be ignored.That's something that will be looked at for Cataclysm, not before. Basically, NG is the talent that makes it so easy for us to reach the haste soft-cap, so it's problematic for us and for Blizzard. Nobody knows what will become of it yet, but i can only welcome a change to this talent if it allows us to benefit more from different stats.
But since it requires a redesign rather than a nerf, it's not something we'll get before Cataclysm.
Post by
MegaVolt
Blizzard know there are issues with Balance Druids, thats why they are buffing Earth and Moon to give an extra 6% damage instead of the old 3%, but this does not fix our scaling issues
I would agree if new content had to be expected. But as it is ICC is the last instance (and gear level) until a major stat/talent change so right now there really is no reason to think about scaling. Classes have to be balanced for the gear you are getting right now and any scaling for potential new gear is just irrelevant since we will never see that happening.
That's why all is needed is a quick'n'dirty fix to make balance Druids in 264 gear competetive. I don't think the E&M change is sufficient since they were really lagging behind but it's a good start.
Post by
404185
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Post by
curlymon
I have been thinking of the above change for some time now and if Blizz ever did decide to make any changes it would be a 3 part change.
Talent: Change Starlight Wrath to 0.5 seconds off SF and a 33% increase to Wrath Damage.
Eclipse would now need to be rebalanced as the base cast time of Wrath would be significantly changed. My napkin math is failing me at this time as for some reason I'm getting nearly 90% chance to proc on crit for wrath for this to work...
Glyph of Wrath: Now also reduces the cast time of Wrath by 0.5 seconds at the cost of a reasonable amount of damage (i.e. not enough to counteract the first tier talent or so little as to cause this to be a boost to single target PvE dps, but maybe find a middle ground and squeeze in a slight boost for PvPkins in there)
As far as I can tell this seems to be the best method to change things as I think Blizz would not like releasing a Glyph that essentially directly counteracts a talent itself.
Edit: Number 3 is for the PvP boomkins to keep them viable (as little as there are).
Post by
182246
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Post by
340332
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
MegaVolt
Again, I understand where you're coming from, and I do sympathise; Moonkins do need a dps buff, and we are getting one. But making us scale better with haste would just make us OP. U have to remember that Moonkin is a 'spec' (for want of a better way of putting it), Druid is the class, and there's so much else we can do already; giving us Mage/Lock dps with the ability to wear leather, shape-shift, Combat Res, Innervate, Decurse and Remove Poisons, not to mention 13% spell damage, 8% crit, 3% hit and 3% haste raid buffs, (Ill leave MotW out of it as any Druid can cast it), would be over the top. We are not just a pure dps caster class.
Blizzard gave valuable and necessary raid buffs to every class. All passive buffs a Moonkin provides can be brought to the raid by other classes as well and every pure dps caster class will bring their own set of passive buffs to the raid which all are awesome. Those buffs do not make a Druid OP in any way since every class got similar ones.
Innervate and battle rezz might count and having more of those in a raid is always good but that should hardly be a reason to do 10% less damage than other classes.
Post by
340332
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